[HEA]
    _____________________   ___                                   _
    |___   ______________| |   |                                 | |
        |  | _             |   |                                 | |
        |  || |            |   |                                 | |
        |  || |            |   |                                 | |
        |  || |            |   |   ____ _   _ _   _   ______     | |
        |  || |            |   |  / __ \ | | / \_/ \  | ___ \    | |
        |  || |__   ____   |   | / /  \  | |  /\ /\ \ | |  \ \   | |
        |  ||  _ \ |  _ \  |   | \ \__/  | | | |_|| | | |__/ /   | |
        |  || | | || |_||  |   |  \___/|_| |_|    |_| | ____/    |_|
        |  || | | || |__   |   |____________________  | |         _
        |__||_| |_|\____/  |________________________| | |        |_|
                                                      | |
         Lighting Your Apple II Path On Delphi        | |
                                                      |_|

                       >>> WELCOME TO THE LAMP! <<<
                       ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                   THINKING KFEST: KansasFest On The Web
              AND THE BEST OF THE A2 AND A2PRO MESSAGE BOARDS

            "Teaching the Apple II user how to fish since 1998"

 ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
 The Lamp!             An Onipa'a Software Production       Vol. 1, No. 7
 ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
 Publisher & Editor.......................Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W., L.S.W.
 Internet Email........................................thelamp@delphi.com
 ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

                             TABLE OF CONTENTS
                             ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                               July 15, 1998


OPENING PITCH
     Simple, Practical, Proven -------------------------------------- [OPN]

A FUNNY THING HAPPENED                                                [FOR]
     The Heat Is On ------------------------------------------------- [HET]
     Miscellanea                                                      [MSC]
     Rumor Mill ----------------------------------------------------- [RMR]
     Public Postings                                                  [PUB]
     Best Of The Best ----------------------------------------------- [BOB]

A2Pro_DUCTIVITY
     Checking out A2PRO on Delphi ----------------------------------- [A2P]

THINKING KFEST
     KansasFest On The Web ------------------------------------------ [KFE]

EXTRA INNINGS
     About The Lamp! ------------------------------------------------ [INN]

                                [*] [*] [*]

READING THE LAMP!   The index system used by The Lamp! is designed to make
"""""""""""""""""   your reading easier.  To use this system, load this
issue into any word processor or text editor.  In the index you will find
something like:

EXTRA INNINGS
     About The Lamp! ------------------------------------------------ [INN]

To read this article, simply use your search or find command to locate
[INN].  There is a similar tag at the end of each article: [EOA].


         :: DISCUSSED ON DELPHI ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
         :                                                       :
         :   I'm not a programmer (but I am one helluva good     :
         :                     tennis player)                    :
         :                                                       :
         ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: PSEMEL ::::::::


[EOA]
[OPN]------------------------------
                     OPENING PITCH |
-----------------------------------
From The Editor
"""""""""""""""
by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W.
                    [thelamp@delphi.com]

                         SIMPLE, PRACTICAL, PROVEN
                         ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

     Since our last talk, to the alternating cheers and jeers of the
mainstream computing crowd, Microsoft unleashed its _Windows 98_ operating
system on an expecting world.  "Windows 98 Party!" cried CompUSA and
Computer City and other giant computing retailing chains, making anxious
buyers late for work the next morning with their after-midnight madness.
Not just on the island, but across the nation if not the world, the hype
that would be king of mainstream computing finally went on sale with all
the hoopla of a Broadway opening--in fact, even more hoopla than that.

     I don't subscribe to the belief that any operating system (regardless
of origin) is evil.  It's just an alternative, and a new version brings
with it all the advances--real and less than--that we're used to with new
technology in any field.  The mythical state of obsolesence is the
direction such an introduction is supposedly pushing us in.  But is it?

     Alternatives to that which is old abound, regardless of what we're
talking about.  For daily transportation, I drive a truck that went out of
production eight years ago.  I heat up my lunch at work in a microwave oven
out of the early '80's, I wear a pair of shoes that I bought almost a year
ago and can't find at the store anymore.  By modern definitions, all of
these things are obsolete, yet the truck still runs, the oven still heats,
and the shoes still pass dress code.  That hasn't changed.

     If you look for a computing example, you need not look far, indeed.
In fact, I have no need to even discuss my old Apple II's--just look at my
Macintosh computers, both of which are no longer in production.  Yet the
keyboard still types, the hard drive still spins, and the screen still
lights up.  It still works.

     As does the Apple II.

     In my estimation, mainstream computer equipment is not unlike
mainstream athletic equipment.  I went for a bicycle ride with a friend of
mine, new to cycling, who showed up with a 24 speed fully suspended
mountain bike to ride with me as I took my tourer, a vintage 1989 converted
Bridgestone mountain bike, on one of the first mid-length rides of the
summer.  He certainly had nice new equipment, including a shiny new helmet,
jersey, and shorts, along with his bike.  Unfortunately for him, he didn't
pick up any new speed along with his stuff, being just as fast as he was
the month before.

     Newer is nice, but is it better?

     As long as there is a place for the new, there'll also be a place for
the not-so-new.  And that's where I'll be, Apple II in tow.

                                [*] [*] [*]

     And Charles Barkley Is Really 6'7" Department: I had announced this
month's issue of _The Lamp!_ would be shorter than usual due to the fact
that KansasFest 1998 is fast approaching and I have a lot to do to get
ready for my annual trip to Avila.  However, as this issue nears
completion, I see that in terms of actual length, this file is longer than
ever.  Don't give me the credit: give the credit to the A2 and A2Pro gang
on Delphi, who have given the opportunity for me to carry their vital
discussions here in _The Lamp!_.

     I'll be leaving for KFest within days.  Take care.



Ryan
thelamp@delphi.com

ASCII ART BEGINS
_________  _                     _                                      _
|__   __| | |                   | |                                    | |
   | |    | |                   | |                                    | |
   | |    | |___     ____       | |       _____   __ ___ _   _ _____   | |
   | |    | ___ \   / __ \      | |      /____ \  | v   v | | v ___ \  | |
   | |    | |  | | | /__\ \     | |       ____| | | /\ /\ | |  /   \ \ | |
   | |    | |  | | | _____|     | |      / ___  | | || || | | |    | | |_|
   | |    | |  | | | |_____     | |____  | |__| | | || || | |  \___/ /  _
   |_|    |_|  |_| \______|     |______| \____^_| |_||_||_| | |\____/  |_|
                                                            | |
                                                            | |
                                                            |_|

ASCII ART ENDS


[EOA]
[OPN]------------------------------
     A FUNNY THING HAPPENED. . . . |
-----------------------------------
Checking out A2 on Delphi
"""""""""""""""""""""""""
by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W.
                    [thelamp@delphi.com]

       * The Heat Is On

              * Miscellanea

                     * Rumor Mill

                            * Public Postings

                                        * Best Of The Best

                              THE HEAT IS ON
                              """"""""""""""

     [*] Apple Operating System    ....... System Software Patches
     [*] Hardware Hacker           ....... Modems + Lightning = New Modems
     [*] The Apple II Legacy       ....... Just Days Left 'Till KFest X
     [*] General Chatter           ....... The Future of the Apple II
     [*] Vendors & Tech Support    ....... Do Not Feed The Energy Creature

                                MISCELLANEA
                                """""""""""

SIS HTML COMPATIBILITY   SIS knows how to deal with all of the HTML 3.2
""""""""""""""""""""""   tags. There are several books you can find at your
local book store which go in detail on the HTML 3.2 syntax. The official
specifications on HTML 3.2 can be found at www.w3.org, but they don't
provide useful examples which can be found in books. I would recommend that
you purchase SIS so you can see how SIS actually parses the tags.

Geoff
                       (SISGEOFF, 13586, GO COM A2)


THE SEARCH FOR SYSTEM 6.0.1 PATCHES   This is what I found - descriptions
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   from memory - I can look them up and
give you more (accurate) detail, if you like:


#54 - Fix ROM Blaster -  Fixes a problem where programs can be loaded
across a 32K memory boundary, causing data from another program to be
wiped.

#57 - Desktop Memory Fixer - Fixes a problem with the Window Manager
forgetting about memory it has allocated and re-allocating it when
switching between graphics modes.

#59 - DiskCount - CDev to make only the correct number of 5.25" drives show
up in Finder.

#64 - Fix Disk Mount Bug - Fixes a problem relating to disk swapping.

#65 - QD Picture Patch - Patches a number of things to allow printing of
large graphics

 - Don (IronTooth)

Delivered by my ANSITerm off-line reader scripts...

                         They're OLRight!
                       (DZAHNISER, 13014, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   BTW - The only patch that I recall from GS+ was 'Dr.Bazyar', which
"""""   patched the High Sierra FST to recognize space characters (and some
other characters) in volume, folder, and file names. According to the
article, the HS.FST was correctly written, but the patch is to allow the
FST to work with volumes created with other operating systems/utilities
that are not adhering to the standard.

 - Don (IronTooth)

Delivered by my ANSITerm off-line reader scripts...

                         They're OLRight!
                       (DZAHNISER, 13015, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   As the author of both FixFontMgr601 and GUPP, GUPP certainly
"""""   obsoletes FFM601 and my FixKern204* patch program for GNO/ME 2.0.4
and some common programs for it. GUPP is faster than the previous programs,
and has one of the best patches-per-disk-block ratios around.

   I do not have any other Softdisk patches handled by GUPP; I've never
bothered asking them to use their code.

Nathan Mates
                        (NMATES, 13019, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   The Magic Routing bug fix (auxtype $00000002 to be accurate) was
"""""   published in the Letters column of GS+ V6.N2.  The letter was from
Michael Guitton of France...

 - Don (IronTooth)

Delivered by my ANSITerm off-line reader scripts...

                         They're OLRight!
                       (DZAHNISER, 13059, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Or, park the System folder out on your desktop in the Finder, which
"""""   is what all the Apple guys did, and why they thought it worked fine
when they released it. With that method, no need to find a filetype changer
(which can be too much of a tool to shoot oneself in the foot if you're not
careful) or anything else.

Nathan "Magic routing is fluff anyhow" Mates
                        (NMATES, 13062, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Ok, my ignorance is going to show... what is magic routing?
"""""
   As it's supposed to work, within the Finder, if you drag a NDA/CDA/CDEV
/etc to the System folder icon and release it, the Finder will deposit
files in the appropriate subdirectory. As Jeff previously noted, support
for FinderExtras is sometimes flakey-- those can go in either the
FinderExtras folder or the System.Setup folder, and the Finder decides for
you where they should go.

   [Anything in FinderExtras will be loaded at Finder [re]startup, and
dumped when the Finder quits or launches things; in System.Setup, they're
loaded once at boot and never dumped. The SS folder method uses more ram,
but can be faster if you launch lots of programs. Not everything is
programmed to be dumped from ram, so do NOT place things in FE unless the
dox (and filetypes-- they're not just something to overwrite at will) say
so]

Nathan Mates
                        (NMATES, 13110, GO COM A2)


PATCHES VERSUS ENHANCEMENTS   I thought that patches to the operating
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""   system was -all- that Diz & Co. did! ;)

GS+Vol7No1 - Dr. Bayzar - ISO 9960 & High Sierra CD-ROM patch
GS+Vol6No6 - Doc Alias - What "Easy Mount" left out
GS+Vol6No4 - Finder Binder - Matches Documents with their Programs
GS+Vol6No3 - Cool Cursor - Is My 'GS Hung or What!
GS+Vol6No3 - Ellifont - Double-Click Any Font to view its style!
GS+Vol6No2 - Geeker - Edits Finder's "Geek" preferences
GS+Vol5No5 - More Sound - Adds more event sounds to the system.
GS+Vol5No4 - What is This? - An _expanded_ Get Info Dialog
GS+Vol4No6 - Extra Bits - Controls all of those Battery RAM switches
                          that Apple forgot to include on the control
                          panels
GS+Vol4No4 - Rainbow - color control of icons and their windows
GS+Vol4No3 - Rebuild DeskTop - There IS a reason why Mac owners are
-                              supposed to rebuild their desktop once
-                              a month. The 'GS has rBundles too!
GS+Vol3No5 - Shuffle - Shuffle up (or down) those stacked windows...
GS+Vol3No5 - Whoosh - Sound, NO Sound; Tunneled Rectangles or NOT...

This list goes all the way back to the system 6 announcement issue.

One may argue that some of these items are not patches, per say, but add-on
features. If a programmer puts a function into an operating system that is
not yet fully implemented or already in the domain of an application
(existing or not), and it is not necessary for the OS to have these
"improvments" to run the machine, I consider it to be a "field
modification" or "patch". (Ya gettin' dis Miz Reno?)


                     Mike Brouillette; the "Un-Dead Apple"
  ,___(?___
 /    _   _\    Delivered via Spectrum v2.1 & Crock 'O Gold v2.1
 \ )|(@)m(_,
  `~7oooood'   (Thanks Ewen, Dave, Robert, Ken, Kit, Gary, et.al.!)
                     (MBROUI11ETTE, 13033, GO COM A2)


SSII RETURNS FROM VACATION   It sure was nice logging onto Delphi after a 3
""""""""""""""""""""""""""   week absense and reading all the kind words
that people had posted about the latest issue of Shareware Solutions II.

I did get back in time for the Monday night multi-system chat, and that was
a fun homecoming.

As I'm sure you can imagine, when I got home, my (snail-mail) mailbox was
filled to the brim, and it's going to take me a while to process all the
orders and mail them out.

I thank you, in advance, for your patience while waiting for your disks to
arrive.

And thanks to Tony Diaz for handling the Bot for the past 3 weeks.

Joe Kohn
                       (JOE_KOHN, 13555, GO COM A2)


NEW BINSCII BUG DETECTED   For the LBR ($E0) file type, what's the
""""""""""""""""""""""""   difference between the auxiliary types $8002 and
$8102? I mostly see the first one, but sometimes the other type is used and
I can't see any pattern. Just curious...

Michael
                          (SAR, 13416, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   $8102 is not listed in the Technical Notes that I have...
"""""
Perhaps the File Type Librarian can give us the answer.

 Ewen Wannop - Speccie
 Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5!
 Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120
 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/
                        (EWANNOP, 13426, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I dimly recall that $8102 was the result of a bug in a BinSCII
"""""   encoder.

--
Steve Reeves
                       (REEVESST, 13456, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   As far as I know, $8102 is not a valid auxtype for LBR ($E0) files
"""""   (it's not listed in the filetype notes.) I do remember seeing it
somewhere, but I can't remember where or what program created it. If anyone
has one of these files, let us know what it is. If it's just a regular
Shrinkit archive then it simply has an incorrect auxtype (which program
created it?)

 -----------------------------------------------------
 Tony Ward, A2 Database Manager
 [Delivered with Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5]
 --
 Pardon me, but your shoe is ringing...
                        (TONYW1, 13504, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I verified that its the GScii+ v2.3.1 encoder that has the bug that
"""""   produces the bogus $8102 auxtype.

--
Steve Reeves
                       (REEVESST, 13535, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   You mean when it extracts a ShrinkIt archive it gives it $8102
"""""   instead of $8002? Shame, shame. :)

Anyway, it won't hurt anything if you change all the $8102 archives to
$8002, as long as they really are ShrinkIt archives.

 -----------------------------------------------------
 Tony Ward, A2 Database Manager
 [Delivered with Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5]
 --
 Today's subliminal message is                .
                        (TONYW1, 13539, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   No, I mean when it creates the BinSCII file, it puts the auxtype
"""""   $8102 into the BinSCII file instead of $8002.  So any program that
decodes that file will give it $8102.  (With the exception of David
Empson's descii, which is smart enough to correct this as a special case.)

--
Steve Reeves
                       (REEVESST, 13540, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   That is bad... GScii should not be changing the file or aux types
"""""   at all. Does it change the aux type of any other file, it could
make a real mess of things if it did?

If you are using Spectrum, then you should discard all the GScii and
BinSCII apps, and use the BinHQX XCMD instead...

 Ewen Wannop - Speccie
 Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5!
 Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120
 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/
                        (EWANNOP, 13573, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   The bug appears to be a rounding error when extracting the high
"""""   byte of the auxtype.  If so, then any auxtype greater than $8000
that doesn't end in 00 would be affected.

--
Steve Reeves
                       (REEVESST, 13619, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Thanks for your legwork in sorting this matter out. I'll go through
"""""   and try to fix as many of the mistyped archives that I can find.
(Just what I need, more work!) And see about finding a solid replacement
for GScii, finally.

Michael
                          (SAR, 13596, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   The latest BinHQX XCMD for Spectrum is available free from the
"""""   library here on Delphi, and supports BinSCII, BinHex 4.0, UUencode
and full MIME Base 64.

You do need Spectrum 2.1 to use it of course...

 Ewen Wannop - Speccie
 Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5!
 Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120
 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/
                        (EWANNOP, 13603, GO COM A2)


RAMFAST AND REALLY LARGE HARD DRIVES   I had a friend ask me what was the
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   largest size hard drive that could
be handled by a GS running GS/OS and a RamFAST.  Since I use a //e, I
didn't have a clue, but told them I'd find out.  I _think_ I've heard of
people with 1 gig drives hooked to their RamFAST card, but what about
larger units, and to what limits?

Thanks!

Later..............Howard
                         (HKATZ, 13687, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   The RamFAST SCSI allows you twelve partitions per drive, and twelve
"""""   active partitions on the SCSI chain, and up to eight SCSI devices
on the chain.

Now, to address your question directly, are we talking -theory- or
actuality?

In actuality, I have used a 1 gig drive on a RamFAST (11 32 meg ProDOS
partitions and one 666 meg HFS partition named "Hades").  It's the biggest
SCSI drive I've had come through here (although if I can scratch up enough
for that nine gig drive I've had my eye on for months, we can test theory a
little :)

In theory, you can go far past one gig.

You can have twelve partitions per drive.  I think the maximum size that
GS/OS allows per volume is 4 gigs and the max size that HFS allows is 2
gigs (Geeks jump in here--at 7 am I don't have references ready :).  If
that's the case, you could have 28 gigs on a hard drive per GS/OS but only
14 gigs because of the HFS limitations.  You couldn't -boot- from such a
drive as there's no ProDOS partition, and I can't imagine partitioning a
drive this way as you have little chance of recovering a file on a HFS
partition gone south, but we're talking theory, right?

Would the RamFAST choke on such a drive?  Certainly, it's possible, but I
also don't have a 28 gig drive to check it out on.

In actuality, be assured that I have personally used a 1 gig drive on a
RamFAST.  If/when I get larger ones that work its way through here, I'll
check them out.

Ryan
KFest '98!
Delivered by OLRight! scripts for ANSITerm
                       (RSUENAGA, 13712, GO COM A2)


IIGS COMPRESSION UTILITIES REVISITED   Time to kick the hornet's nest.  :)
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
Okay, so with the newly-uploaded compression utility, Hard Pressed, I find
that I now have a choice between it and my old standby, AutoArk.

AutoArk has worked nearly flawlessly for me since I purchased it some time
ago, but I find myself wondering if perhaps I should give HP a fair chance
to impress me enough to switch over to it instead... yes, that will take
awhile to do, but if HP is a better program, I'm willing to do it.

That said, I should mention that I don't compress active program files. So
far I've only used it to compress text files and unused program files, to
save HD space.

So, for someone like me, is it worth switching over?  :)

If anyone has used both, and would like to share war stories or just
personal experiences that led to choosing one over the other, I'd love to
hear them.

I'm not trying to hurt feelings or start a "mine is better than yours" kind
of debate, please. Let's try to be kind. :)

Thank You.


 Hugs, Goldfische
 Conference Manager, New Age Forum (go rel new)
 Web: {<http://www.delphi.com/newage> Newage}

 Reduce, Reuse, Recycle, Renew ...
 The Earth Belongs To Our Children

 Sent by Spectrum 2.1 & COG 2.3 for the AppleIIGS

---

 Viva la Text!
                      (GOLDFISCHE, 13433, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I once tried a disk compression utility, and quickly decided it was
"""""   safer and faster if I did not use it. Most disk utilities will not
help you when you get a problem...

With the PC using more and more SCSI drives, the price of hard drives is
dropping through the floor. The need for a compression utility is no longer
what it was. Here in the UK it is now very difficult to get hold of drives
as small as 2Gb. The commonest starter size is now 4Gb at around $200. This
means that your friendly Mac dealer is going to be awash with left over
500Mb-2Gb drives from Mac owners who have upgraded...

 Ewen Wannop - Speccie
 Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5!
 Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120
 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/
                        (EWANNOP, 13440, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Keep in mind, though, that a file-based compression utility (like
"""""   HardPressed or AutoArk) is much safer than a disk-based compression
utility like you tend to see on the PC.

Compressed disks can get into a state where the entire disk becomes
useless. But compressed files are just... files. You should be able to
unpack them one by one if you need to, if an emergency arises and you have
to turn off the compression software.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                        (SHEPPY, 13443, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Well, I've used both of those and I liked HardPressed much better
"""""   HardPressed is lots faster than AutoArk and it works somewhat
different; the biggest advantage of HardPressed is, you can tell it the
names of folders and every item in that folder is automatically compressed
or decompressed when you need it. HardPressed leaves the icons alone so
even a compressed file has the "original" Icon HardPressed works
transparently, so you don't even notice it doing its work. In the end I had
all five partitions of my IIGS HD compressed (except the System folder,
although there are items which can be compressed, too, in the System
folder) and it worked flawlessly from day one.

Even the images for Bernie are compressed by HardPressed, as I just made
the real ProDOS HD into images as they were.

BTW, if you read this Henrik, HDT 2.0.5 has no ProDOS support any more! I
had to downgrade to 1.8.x for getting the ProDOS HD recognized. It was
impossible with 2.0.5 to install a Mac driver on that HD.

Udo
Ceterum censeo, Microsoft esse delendam
                        (UDOHUTH, 13488, GO COM A2)


INTREC ON MODEMS AND CABLES
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""
 >  ...if you're looking for a highspeed modem, try this one. It's dirt
 > cheap...

 > Anybody figured out how to get it to download using ProTerm?

Let's analyse that: A really cheapo modem, what's wrong with ProTERM ?? :|

The easiest way for major modem (and any appliance device) manufacturers to
develop sales in other markets, is to take the guts of their popular
device, inhibit the feature-functions slightly, change the package, and
sell at a low-ball price under a pseudonym and psuedomodel. All they've
done is to make the device less attractive, less usable, and low-cost
availability. This allows them to manufacture the entire line, even the
quality model at a much lower cost, and to also sell the quality product at
a much higher profit, and the inhibited model at a cheap price that will
move large quantities. A similar strategy has always been common in the
auto industry where there are many common parts for Cad, Pontiac, Chev such
as glass, trim, roller, hinge, closure parts, et al. Parts is parts! :)

Large appliance/goods stores, Sears, Wards, etc., put a twist on this
strategy. They do not sell the cheap model, but privately refer to these
(inhibited) models as "bolt-downs" because they're the ones advertised but
never sold (they are in essence, bolted to the floor - thus the name). They
are advertised cheap, the customer comes to buy one and the salesperson,
under pressure of losing their job, makes sure the bolt-down, is =never=
sold, but those with the bells and whistles (and profit margin) move out of
the warehouse at a good clip. The lowly bolt-down, most probably the only
one in stock, remains until it dies of obsolescence. However, large
quantities of the "bolt-down" are moved through those schlocky horrid ads
on radio, TV and newspaper from stores that hawk the cheap stuff.

I bought a brand name TV cheap, at a schlock store. Later to find that if I
would have shopped, I could have had the same brand, different model at a
slightly higher price, that model had features I would have enjoyed using
and would have paid the difference to get. I then came to realize what I
already knew -- I had purchased a bolt-down -- some of us are slow learners
:)

Another lesson is later learned, what do I do if I have a problem or a
question? The store I bought my TV from couldn't/wouldn't help, and later
closed their doors. The credited stores (Sears, Wards etc) have excellent
return, guarantee and repair facilities for their appliances but we are
lucky to find anyone that will talk to us if we happen to buy the bolt-down
from the price vendors.

That being said:

 > Anybody figured out how to get it to download using ProTerm?

Another Delphi user asked about this modem and ProTERM, and Greg Schaefer
offered this:

 ...tack on an E0 to the end of [the init string] (ProTERM requires that
modem echo be disabled). ...boot directly into ProDOS8 to make sure there
is no GS/OS stuff running which might cause data loss [and try it again].

Booting directly into ProDOS 8 apparently resolved the problem for her.
Anything stealing clock cyles can play havoc with download protocol timing.

Regards,

 AutoReply: Jerry Cline @ InTrec Software, Inc. - jerry@intrec.com
 ProTERM @ your service! The superior telnet and dialup application.
 Sent w/ProTERM Message Manager (PTMM) - Details @ <ptmm@intrec.com>
 Download ProTERM & PTMM the full working versions: <www.intrec.com>
                        (INTREC, 13179, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   A point of clarity here.
"""""
While it is true that all cables are not created equal, if the cable is
designed for use on a Mac, is sold with a quality product of a recognized
brand, and is a hand-shake design (if it sells with a modem faster than
9600, it better be), the chances of the cable being correctly wired are
very high.

On the other hand if the cable is sold with a cheap off brand, modem, who
knows unless there is a pinout (schematic) of the  available. Customers
have sent cables to us in their modes of frustration, and some have been
wired for who knows for what -- we have no clue?? In those cases, our modem
cable easily resolved the problem.

The common cable problem is when cable "looks" right, but is not checked.
Until recently, there were many more printers than modems, and the chance
of getting a printer cable was high. Printers are terminal devices (the
signal stops there) and modems are not (they pass the signal through).
Consequently, the send and receive pins are reversed on a printer cable
because when the printer needs to communicate with the CPU, it sends a
signal via the send pin to the receive pin on the CPU, and the CPU sends to
its send pin which is received by the printer's receive pin.

As it relates to Spectrum, I assume they still advocate the design from the
ProTERM manual that Greg Schaefer designed. I say this because several
years ago, Seven Hills verbally requested permission to also advocate that
same design, and we gave that permission. I think the person who called was
Dave? I'm sure they would agree with what I stated above.

One of the great attributes of the cable design we use is, it is completely
universal from 300 baud to whatever bps it is pressed it to meet.

Regards,

 AutoReply: Jerry Cline @ InTrec Software, Inc. - jerry@intrec.com
 ProTERM @ your service! The superior telnet and dialup application.
 Sent w/ProTERM Message Manager (PTMM) - Details @ <ptmm@intrec.com>
 Download ProTERM & PTMM the full working versions: <www.intrec.com>
                        (INTREC, 13180, GO COM A2)


STAN, GARY, AND RYAN AND THE RAMFAST REVISION B ODYSSEY   I posted this on
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   Genie, also, but
just to make sure I get a good sampling of sage advice, I'm putting it
here, too. :)

A friend of mine recently gave me RamFast rev. B SCSI card. I currently
have it installed in a "spare" GS that I'm putting together. I hooked up a
little NCS SCSI drive that I have so I could check the card out, but
instead of booting up, it returns the "Unable to locate ProDOS" message.
(The first partition on this drive =does= have a bootable system setup and
boots just fine on my main GS, BTW.) I =believe= I had everything
configured correctly in the RamFast Utilities when I booted it up the first
time, but now I can't seem to get back into the utility screen to check the
configuration. :/

My questions are:

1) How do I get back to the Utilities screen to check the configuration? I
   tried holding down the "8" key while booting (which works with my
   RamFast rev. D card on my GS at school), but that doesn't work.

2) Is there anything else that might cause that error message that I am
   perhaps overlooking?

This friend says that the RamFast worked fine the last time he used it, but
that was several years ago.

Any ideas, suggestions, or random thoughts will be appreciated. :)


 Stan Marks
 stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com
 Delivered by Spectrum v2.5 and COG
 KFest '98 Bound!
                       (STANMARKS, 13138, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I've always used numeric-keypad-0, and that's worked on my Rev C
"""""   and Rev D (ROM versions 3.0something thru 3.01f). 8 is the key to
ProDOS-8 boot in an unmodified System 6.x.

Nathan Mates
                        (NMATES, 13139, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   Uhm...heheh...I knew that! :}
"""""
Unfortunately, the 0 key doesn't seem to work, either Nathan, BUT...
changing the RamFast to another slot screws up it's configuration and
=forces= it to boot into the RamFast Utilities. <G>

Ryan and Tony were "helping" me with this last night in the A2 conference,
and that's how I discovered that I could force the RamFast into the
Utilities screen, but when I finally did get there, it seems that there is
NO TransWarp option, and there IS a "Slot Allocation Priority" setting,
both of which Ryan thinks indicate an old set of ROM chips begging for an
upgrade.

Just to clarify the problem, I presently have the RamFast card installed in
Slot 7 of a "spare" ROM 3 GS with a 4-meg memory card. (I also tried it in
a ROM 01 with the same memory card and got the same results.) I have an NCS
HD that is my secondary drive on my main GS and which is connected to an
Apple High Speed SCSI card. This drive has 2 partitions: NCS.1 (ProDOS, 32
Mb) and NCS.2 (HFS, 129.5 Mb). The first partition has a full system 6.0.1
installed and will boot up just fine on my main GS...the "fun" begins when
I hook it up to the RamFast on the other computer.

When the drive is connected to the RamFast on the other machine, it appears
to operate normally but returns the "Unable to locate ProDOS" message...and
yet, ProDOS IS there on the drive, and yes, the slot assignments are
correctly set in the Control Panels (S7-Your Card). (Remember...I said it
boots just fine on my main machine with the AHS card? :) Any attempts to
bring up the RamFast Utilities from the ROMDisk (rebooting with the 0 key)
to check the configuration is futile, but, again, I CAN force it by moving
the card to another slot. Even doing so and re-configuring the card (and
reassigning the startup to S6-Your Card) yields the same error message.
So...

I then tried putting my Focus card in with the RamFast and booting with it.
The Focus boots up just fine, the CVTECH.ROM shows up on the screen, and
the RamFast recognizes NCS.1 but NOT NCS.2! If I try to run the RamFast
Utilities from either the ROMDisk or NCS.1, it asks me to "insert the disk
NCS.2"! Pressing Return yields the same request, so I have to Escape to get
out of the utilities. If I try to run the utilities from the Focus drive,
the computer crashes, and I'm back to square one! :/

So, after "sleeping on it", the following conclusions occur to me:

1) The RamFast IS working, but maybe it doesn't recognize the ProDOS on the
   NCS.1 partition OR the #2 HFS partition (yet it DOES recognize a 27 Mb
   HFS partition on the Focus), which leads me to believe that...

2) The RamFast ROMs need to be replaced with Rev.C ROMs.

Does that sound reasonable/plausible/possible?

Any other ideas or suggestions?


 Stan Marks
 stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com
 Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5
 KFest '98 Bound!
                       (STANMARKS, 13159, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   When you get into the utilities screen you should see, in the upper
"""""   left quadrant of that screen, a few lines of text that give you,
among other things, the ROM revision of the RF utilities. If you don't, you
have a REALLY REALLY old Rev B card. :)

Gary R. Utter
                         (UTTER, 13181, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   Well, I have a REALLY REALLY old Rev. B card, then. <G>
"""""
Actually, Ryan pointed that out to me the other night...so, now the
question is, "What does that mean?"  Is the card usable as is or should I
(can I, even?) upgrade the ROMs?

As per Ryan's instructions, I called Sequential yesterday and told them
that I had a Rev.C card (yes, that's what Ryan told me to tell them :) and
needed the upgraded ROMs, U15 & U16, for it. They wanted me to send the
card to them, insisting I could not perform the upgrade myself. They also
wanted $45 to do the upgrade, but what they were talking about was
upgrading a Rev.C to a Rev.D card. I finally had to tell them that I
actually had a Rev.B card and just wanted to upgrade it to Rev.C. They said
that they didn't even know if they could do that, but if I wanted to send
it in that they would try it - no promises. I told them I would get back to
them. :)

So...what - if anything - can I do with this thing?


 Stan Marks
 stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com
 Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5
 KFest '98 Bound!
                       (STANMARKS, 13186, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   The card is not really usable as is. The ROM has some seriously
"""""   nasty bugs.

However, I am currently running RamFast #0022, which is to say, I KNOW that
your card can be brought up to current standards.

You need the current revision of U15 and U16, and you need to make sure
that your DRAM is up to snuff. If it is Samsung, replace it. Period.

There were SOME Rev Bs that went out with a midly defective oscillator
crystal, but not all of them.  Probably a good idea to replace it just to
be on the safe side. I'm not sure what the specs are for the replacement,
but one of the tech types should be able to tell you. (It's a simple
soldering job.)

If it comes down to that, I have some fairly recent ROM chips here. I'm not
sure HOW recent, but they are a lot better than what you have. :)

Gary R. Utter
                         (UTTER, 13188, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Gary's info in message 13188 is very, very to the point and much
"""""   more direct than the following post, however, it might be helpful
for trivia fans. . .

>> If you don't, you have a REALLY REALLY old Rev B card. :)

> Well, I have a REALLY REALLY old Rev. B card, then. <G>

> Actually, Ryan pointed that out to me the other night...so, now the
> question is, "What does that mean?"  Is the card usable as is or should
> I (can I, even?) upgrade the ROMs?

It means you need to do something about it ("something" detailed below) for
it to be usable; no, it's not usable as is really; and yes you should and
yes you can upgrade the ROMs.

> As per Ryan's instructions, I called Sequential yesterday and told them
> that I had a Rev.C card (yes, that's what Ryan told me to tell them :)

Yes, that's exactly what I said to tell them, for reasons explained in
detail below. . .

> and needed the upgraded ROMs, U15 & U16, for it. They wanted me to send
> the card to them, insisting I could not perform the upgrade myself.

They're wrong :)

> They also wanted $45 to do the upgrade, but what they were talking about
> was upgrading a Rev.C to a Rev.D card. I finally had to tell them that I
> actually had a Rev.B card and just wanted to upgrade it to Rev.C. They
> said that they didn't even know if they could do that, but if I wanted
> to send it in that they would try it - no promises. I told them I would
> get back to them. :)

Okay; here's a bit of history, and a bit of explanation. . .

When we discuss "RamFAST Revisions" there are two different things we could
be talking about:

1) The board revision

and

2) The ROM revision

There are three distinct RamFAST board revisions (aka card revisions) out
there: the Rev. B, Rev. C, and Rev. D (intentionally ignoring the special
//e compatible Rev. D card which I've never seen, and the Rev. A which
never made public distribution).

The Rev. B and Rev. C cards are practically identical, and, in fact, are
almost indistinguishable unless the person trying to tell the difference
really knows what to look for.  In fact, they use =the same ROMs= (more
later on the significance of this, besides what is blatantly obvious).
They are usable with the //e and IIgs, are large cards with dip switches,
and can't easily be upgraded beyond 256k of cache (they can be upgraded,
just not easily by mere mortals).

The Rev. D card is a distinctly different beastie which is IIgs compatible
only, eliminated the DIP switches in favor of a single jumper and the
RamFAST util program, and only uses a single replacable ROM chip instead of
the 2 that the Rev. B/C cards use.

Now, old timers know that Sequential is not the originator of the RamFAST;
it was born via CVTech, which sold the rights to it and the 8 meg IIgs card
that Sequential currently sells to Sequential.  When Sequential took over
support of the RamFAST, for some reason, it totally stopped supporting Rev.
B cards, and really, they don't know anything whatsoever about it.
However, as you see above, the Rev. C card, which it still supports, is
functionally identical, so. . . simply order the Rev. C ROMs, and replace
the ROMs currently in the Rev. B with them.

The older (I would guess pre-3.00 but I'm not 100% sure) versions of the
RamFAST ROMs couldn't do anything with partitions larger than 32 megs
(okay, maybe CD ROMs were a special case, but I didn't have a CD Rom drive
in those days :), which is why the HFS partition that Stan is unable to
mount is not recognized (really, those were pre System 6, pre-HFS.FST days,
so greater than 32 meg partitions were not an issue).

So, what you need to do is upgrade the ROMs in the Rev. B RamFAST by using
the current 3.01f versions of the Rev. C ROMs.  Technically, this is not
the same as going to a Rev. C from a Rev. B; it's merely upgrading the ROM,
not the card, and Sequential will get confused (as you can see) when you
say anything bout a Rev. B card.  Just tell them you want the Rev. C ROMs.

And, if you're wondering how I know all of this, it's because I have a Rev.
B RamFAST right here in the GS that's posting this message, with Rev. 3.01f
ROMs for the Rev. C RamFAST in them, and the thing works like an absolute
champ. :)

> So...what - if anything - can I do with this thing?

Well, you can give it to me. . . :)

Ryan
KFest '98!
Delivered by OLRight! scripts for ANSITerm
                       (RSUENAGA, 13189, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   In message 'RE: RamFast rev.B problem (Re: Msg 13186)' UTTER said:
"""""
> You need the current revision of U15 and U16, and you need to make sure
> that your DRAM is up to snuff. If it is Samsung, replace it. Period.

Yeah, Ryan said something about that the other night. Looking at the card,
I don't =see= any chips with "Samsung" on them, but there are several with
a stylized S or ST. Are either of those Samsung?


> There were SOME Rev Bs that went out with a midly defective oscillator
> crystal, but not all of them. Probably a good idea to replace it just to
> be on the safe side.

Where would I find the oscillator chip?


> If it comes down to that, I have some fairly recent ROM chips here. I'm
> not sure HOW recent, but they are a lot better than what you have. :)

Thanks, Gary...I'll keep that in mind. :)


 Stan Marks
 stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com
 Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5
 KFest '98 Bound!
                       (STANMARKS, 13190, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Electronically speaking, the Rev B and the Rev C are TOTALLY
"""""   identical. The first production run (for public sale) of the
RamFast was the Rev B card. After the first 200 boards were made, a minor
design error was discovered. This error was fixed by installing 1 or 2
jumper wires on the card (I forget how many).

The Rev C card is simply a Rev B card with those jumper wires traced right
into the card.  The ONLY change in the Rev C is that the two jumpers were
made into traces and the Rev level of the card was changed from B to C.

Gary R. Utter
                         (UTTER, 13196, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   "I don't =see= any chips with "Samsung" on them, but there are
"""""   several with a stylized S or ST. Are either of those Samsung?"

Might be. There is a bank of 8 DRAM chips on there, just like on a memory
card. Those are the ones that you need to be concerned about. You can
replace them with stock GS DRAM chips. Given the current price of those
chips, I'd probably replace them just for luck. (When that card was made,
those chips were close to $100. :)

>> "Where would I find the oscillator chip?"

It's not a chip, it's a little metal "can". There is a crystal inside it,
it looks like a crystal from an old scanner or CB radio, if you have ever
seen one of those.

Oh, and when I said "fairly recent", the chips I was referring to are at
LEAST 4 years old, probably more. :)

Gary R. Utter
                         (UTTER, 13197, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   OK...if you're talking about the cache memory chips, those appear
"""""   to be the same as on the old AE GS-RAM card I got (from the same
friend ). They have a stylized M inside a circle (just guessing, here -
Motorola?) and some of the numbers on the chips are the same as on the ones
on the GS-RAM card.


>>>"Where would I find the oscillator chip?"

> It's not a chip, it's a little metal "can".

Yeah, I knew that. :)

What I meant was, where could I =buy= the oscillator, if I need to?

> Oh, and when I said "fairly recent", the chips I was referring to are at
> LEAST 4 years old, probably more. :)

Well, I'd bet that this particular card is probably much older than that.
:)

I was looking at csa2m today, and Steve Buggie had a post there in which he
stated that he has the upgrade ROM chip for the Rev.B card for $3. He
specifically used the word "chip" and not the plural "chips", and that got
me to wondering which is correct - one chip or two? (Of course, he coulda
meant to type "chips".) Anyway, I emailed him to ask about them.

BTW, Gary, do you know of any other sources of those upgrade ROMs besides
Sequential?


 Stan Marks
 stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com
 Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5
 KFest '98 Bound!
                       (STANMARKS, 13199, GO COM A2)

>>>>>  "What I meant was, where could I =buy= the oscillator, if I need
"""""   to?"

Any reasonable electonics store (meaning "NOT Radio Shack") ought to have
these; if not, you can try mail order to such places as JDR, Jameco,
Mouser, or any of a whole bunch of different places. . .

> I was looking at csa2m today, and Steve Buggie had a post there in which
> he stated that he has the upgrade ROM chip for the Rev.B card for $3. He
> specifically used the word "chip" and not the plural "chips", and that
> got me to wondering which is correct - one chip or two? (Of course, he
> coulda meant to type "chips".) Anyway, I emailed him to ask about them.

I'll bet you a SSII subscription extension that what is being sold is a
different beastie.  Here's another Apple II history thing for ya. . .

Apple Computer, Inc. sold two different SCSI cards for the Apple II: The
Apple II SCSI and the Apple II High Speed SCSI.  The Apple II SCSI went
through three different ROM revisions: Rev. A, Rev. B, and Rev. C. Anything
pre-Rev. C is just asking for problems (nasty bugs including stuff like
formatting a volume when trying to eject a 3.5 inch disk) and in fact,
GS/OS just plain won't run on a pre Rev. C card.  The upgrade to that is a
single chip.  It is merely coincidence that there is a Rev. C Apple SCSI
card (as well as a Rev. B) and a Rev. C RamFAST SCSI card (as well as a
Rev. B and Rev. D).

> BTW, Gary, do you know of any other sources of those upgrade ROMs
> besides Sequential?

Unless Alltech has them, the only place that I knew that carried them was
LRO (aka Other World Computing), and I'd prefer to order from Sequential to
them. . .

Ryan
KFest '98!
Delivered by OLRight! scripts for ANSITerm
                       (RSUENAGA, 13210, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   "?They have a stylized M inside a circle (just guessing, here -
"""""   Motorola?)"

I think so, yeah. Definitely not Samsung.

>> "where could I =buy= the oscillator, if I need to?"

Lotsa places, it's a pretty standard part, the problem is to learn just
what you need for a replacement (and whether you need it at all).

>> "He specifically used the word "chip" and not the plural "chips", and
>>  that got me to wondering which is correct - one chip or two? "

YOU need both chips, U15 and U16. _One_ of them didn't need to be revised
after something like v2.1, but whatever you have is a LOT older than that.

(DO NOT attempt a 1 chip upgrade with that card, do not put in the 1 chip
and just try it out. You WILL regret it. Trust me. :)

>> "...do you know of any other sources of those upgrade ROMs besides
>>  Sequential?"

Certainly not a legal source, and for that matter, I don't know of an
illegal one either.

By the way, with regard to Ryan's comment that you NEED to update those
ROMs, he is absolutely right. Your current ROMs have some serious bugs that
will, sooner or later, trash large quantities of your data. I was a beta
tester on those things. I know.

Gary R. Utter
                         (UTTER, 13227, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   OK...I just got off the phone with Sequential (who says Florence is
"""""   the Wicked Witch of the West?? ;), and here's what they told me:

The EPROM chip is (according to Florence) the one I need to upgrade my
RAMFast to v3.01f. When I asked about the U15 and U16 chips, she said that
those were soldered into the board and I would have to send it to them for
replacement. When I told her that the chips on MY board were socketed
chips, she had no idea what I was talking about unless I had, perhaps, one
of the very first Rev. C boards. (I didn't tell her otherwise. :)

BTW, I was looking in the computer that this card was in when I got it and
there, lying in the bottom of the case, was a small label with "U16 v1.0"
hand-printed on it. :)

So, anyway...now what do I do? Should I call them back and see if they even
have the old U15 & U16 chips? Should I order the EPROM chip, too?


 Stan Marks
 stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com
 Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5
 KFest '98 Bound!
                       (STANMARKS, 13241, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Special for you Stan, I just pulled my Rev. B RamFAST.  I don't
"""""   like to do that because the GS with the RamFAST Rev. B I have here
is in an incredibly inconvenient place to deal with, but -special for you-
I pulled it (i.e. you're buying the beer at KFest '98).

The stickers on the two chips in question are as follows:

U15:

Sequential Systems
copyright (c) 1995
rev. U15CRF301-F

U16:

Sequential Systems
copyright (c) 1995
rev. U16-2.01

> OK...I just got off the phone with Sequential (who says Florence is the
> Wicked Witch of the West?? ;), and here's what they told me:

> The EPROM chip is (according to Florence) the one I need to upgrade my
> RAMFast to v3.01f. When I asked about the U15 and U16 chips, she said
> that those were soldered into the board and I would have to send it to
> them for replacement. When I told her that the chips on MY board were
> socketed chips, she had no idea what I was talking about unless I had,
> perhaps, one of the very first Rev. C boards. (I didn't tell her
> otherwise. :)

Argh. . . .

> BTW, I was looking in the computer that this card was in when I got it
> and there, lying in the bottom of the case, was a small label with "U16
> v1.0" hand-printed on it. :)

> So, anyway...now what do I do? Should I call them back and see if they
> even have the old U15 & U16 chips? Should I order the EPROM chip, too?

Okay; first, some clarification: both U15 and U16 are ROMs, PROMs, EPROMs
(not EEPROMs, though, I don't think, although they certainly could be :)
These acronyms, assuming everyone understands ROM is Read Only Memory,
mean:

PROM   = Programmable ROM
EPROM  = Erasable Programmable ROM
EEPROM = Electically Erasable Programmable ROM

In any case, the U15 is a 27C256 EPROM, and the U16 is a 2764A-2 EPROM.

From what Florence said to you above, it clearly sounds to me like she
still thinks you have a Rev. D RamFAST.

What you need to order, exactly, are the ROM upgrade chips (call them ROMs,
PROMs, EPROMs, whatever :) for the Rev. C RamFAST, specifically the U15 and
U16, which are the only ROM chips on the board.  I find it appalling, but
not surprising, that Sequential is having such a difficult time with this.

If need be, I can see if I can find the receipt from the last time I
ordered these things from them, but if they can't already tell exactly what
you need from your description, I'll be stunned if the part number would
help. . .

Ryan
Proud owner of RamFAST Rev. B # 0128
KFest '98!
Delivered by OLRight! scripts for ANSITerm
                       (RSUENAGA, 13248, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   Well, it appears that the RAMFast rev.B ROM upgrade dilemma is
"""""   finally solved! I called Sequential this morning, talked to Joe M.
(Florence wasn't there ;), explained the situation thoroughly, and it was,
like: "Oh! THOSE ROM chips! OK...no big deal, we have those in stock and
can ship them right out to you!" Geez...

Thanks, Ryan and Gary!


 Stan Marks
 stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com
 Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5
 KFest '98 Bound!
                       (STANMARKS, 13267, GO COM A2)



                                RUMOR MILL
                                """"""""""

SIMCITY FOR THE IIGS--FANTASY AND FACT   It doesn't exist; the GS version
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   of SimCity was started by Bill
Heineman, but Maxis wanted $100,000 for the rights to release the game, so
work was stopped with the game only about 20% done (Burger will tell you
it's 80% done, but that's the way he is :).

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                        (SHEPPY, 13549, GO COM A2)


TRACKING THE RARE JOKO ON VACATION BY THE WOOFSTER   Important message to
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   all friends of Joe
Kohn... The Meister is still alive! He has been sighted near Bejing in a
yurt with a hot dog. (spell it: h o t d o g) :-)

Henrik Woof Gudat
delivered by Bernie 1.3 CerealPuffs/MuesliPump
                        (GUDATH, 13300, GO COM A2)


RANDOM REFLECTIONS ON REALITY AND THE APPLE II   I'm tempted to say here
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   here to your six points,
but I got in trouble last time I did that, so I'll just say that I agree.

But the bottom line is that the Apple II is coming to (has gone past?) a
turning point, where every user needs to look at their Apple II and
seriously consider why they still have it.

If it is because you have a soft spot in your heart for it, either because
you grew up with, or you think it is a thing of beauty, then the last thing
you'd want to do is change it or upgrade it. You want the Apple II as it
is.

If it is because you cannot afford something better, and let's not pick
bones here, the Mac and W95 *ARE* better in many ways, most significantly
speed. You can argue the importance of proportional scroll bars and the
supposed elegance of GS/OS all you like, but these other machine do more,
faster. If it because you can't afford anything better, then upgrading the
Apple II is not going to help, because you still wouldn't be able to afford
it. And trust me, the costs WOULD be more expensive than a new Mac or PC.

So seriously, I cannot see any reason to upgrade it. And if there was a
reason, there's always the emulator market. But then it gets down to
whether an emulator is supposed to emulate the past as a way to preserve
what once was, or whether it is a way forward. Again, it may be better to
just buy a Mac or PC for the heavy duty work, and keep the II for fun.

Regards,
 Richard
                       (RICHARD_B, 13431, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I just wanted to comment on some of the ideas and comments in this
"""""   thread.

We are working our bottoms off to offer a reliable emulation software and,
once we got there, upgrade path. The future of Apple II emulation and Apple
IIgs emulation in particular is to combine Apple II functionality with
features offered by the hosting machine. This is IMO the only
cost-effective way to push the Apple II platform ahead. It doesn't involve
asking anyone for permission, it doesn't stop anyone from implementing fun
features, it costs you a measly $25, and it won't stop Apple II computing
to change for the better. And if it were Gus that saved the emulation
world, that would free me from working on Bernie and I had a lot more spare
time. Fine with me! :)

As Richard suggested, the fun starts when adding features that go beyond a
stock IIgs.

woof,
- henrik
                        (GUDATH, 13494, GO COM A2)



                              PUBLIC POSTINGS
                              """""""""""""""

JUST DAYS REMAINING!!!
""""""""""""""""""""""
 ______      _____
(      )   (      )     ____________________________________________
 |     |  /     /      (        _____________________________'98____)
 |     | /     /        |      |
 |     |/     /         |      |                         II Infinitum!!
 |           /          |      |______
 |     |\     \         |      _______) __________    _________  ________
 |     | \     \        |      |       (     _____)  (     ___) (__    __)
 |     |  \     \       |      |        |   |__       \    \       |   |
 |     |   \     \      |      |        |    __)       \    \      |   |
 |     |    \      \    |      |        |   |_____   ___\    \     |   |
(______)    (________) (_______)       (__________) (_________)    |___|


MORE NEWS ON KANSASFEST 1998!

KansasFest 1998 will be held once again on the campus of Avila College
in Kansas City, Missouri. It will take place from July 22 - July 26,
1998.

The cost of attending KFest '98 is only $365, which -includes- the use
of a double room in the Avila College dorms -and- meals!  There are also
a limited number of single rooms available for $465.  (If you wish to
stay at one of the many hotels or motels near the college then the cost
is $265, but you would, of course, have to find and pay for your own room
and meals.)

Confirmed speakers for this year include Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
(Wolfenstein 3D for the Apple IIgs), Nathan Mates (Twilight II 2.0),
Tony Diaz (Alltech Electronics), Ewen Wannop (Spectrum), Geoff Weiss
(Spectrum Internet Suite), Mike Westerfield (ByteWorks) and Joe Kohn
(Shareware Solutions II).

This year, we are running a number of contests, including the Roger
Wagner tie contest, a Door Sign contest, and, for all of you programmers,
we are also planning our first Hack Contest!  Rules are still pending,
but stay tuned for details.  It's -highly- suggested anyone interested in
these contests (and possible prizes) tune into the KFest Information
Mailing List (see how to subscribe below).

Check-in will be on Wednesday from 1-4 pm, and check-out from 11 am
- 1 pm on Sunday. Computer sessions will be conducted on Thursday and
Friday. A vendor fair and software and hardware demos are scheduled
for Saturday.

To get KFest info by email, subscribe to the KansasFest Information
Mailing List.  Send email to majordomo@trenco.gno.org.  In the BODY
of the message, place the following text:

                subscribe kfest

You will receive a confirmation email.  In order to be signed up for
the list, you will have to respond to this confirmation as the
instructions dictate.  You will then be sent a welcome message,
including instructions on how to send mail to the list.

If you have other questions about KFest, or wish to make suggestions,
you can find answers via the InterNet. Just send an email message to
kfest@intrec.com or kfest-help@trenco.gno.org, or visit the World Wide
Web page at http://www.primenet.com/~adams/kfest.html

Here's hoping to see all of you in Kansas City in July!
                       (RSUENAGA, 13225, GO COM A2)


WOLFENSTEIN 3D SHOOTOUT AT KFEST   OK, Kfest-ers...it's time to "Get
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   Psyched"!!

Announcing the KFest Wolfenstein 3D Shootout!

Do you spend much of your free time roaming the halls of Castle
Wolfenstein, laying waste to Nazis and their Mutant Minions? Think you're
pretty hot? Well, here's your chance to prove it!

This year, I thought it would be an interesting "diversion" to have a
contest featuring the latest and greatest game for the GS to come along in
years...the long-awaited, much-anticipated Wolfenstein 3D! If you would
like to find out just how good you are, here are the (tentative) rules:

1. One or more accelerated GS's (mine will be available) will be set up
   for players to use. (If someone would like to volunteer a Power Mac with
   Bernie and Wolf 3D on it, that might be nice, also. :)  An "anonymous"
   scenario of not more than 10 levels will be chosen for the contest.

2. Players will proceed to play this scenario from scratch (basic
   weapons/ammo configuration) and with NO CHEAT CODES! The game will open
   with the default screen size (#4), but contestants may adjust the screen
   size to suit individual preferences.

3. Players may NOT save their games at each level! If you get "killed",
   you must start that level over from scratch. (However, if it becomes
   necessary for a player to interrupt the game, for some reason, it will
   be permissable to save the game to resume at a later time.)

4. When the game is completed (when the victory banner is displayed),
   players will record their final scores on the provided scoresheet.

5. The winner will be determined by the highest final score. In the event
   of a tie, contestants will play a tie-breaker round of one level chosen
   by a "referee".

I think that this will give us a pretty level playing field for the
contest. Anyone having other ideas or suggestions for the Wolf 3D Shootout
is welcome to post them. :)


 Stan Marks
 stanmarks@delphi.com OR s.marks3@genie.com
 Delivered by Spectrum v2.1 and COG v2.5
 KFest '98 Bound!
                       (STANMARKS, 13577, GO COM A2)


GSOFT CALLS ALL BETA TESTERS
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""

Beta Test Announcement
----------------------

The Byte Works, Inc. is looking for a small number of dedicated beta
testers for a new Apple IIGS programming language. After carefully reading
the specifics, if youre interested, please contact Mike Westerfield by
e-mail at MikeW50@AOL.COM, sending the completed form at the end of this
announcement.

The Program
-----------

The program is GSoft BASIC, an interpreted BASIC for the Apple IIGS. It
supports many advanced features, a few not found in any other BASIC were
aware of on any platform. Some of the major features are:

* Multiple number formats, including BYTE, INTEGER, LONG, SINGLE and
  DOUBLE.
* Program and variable size is limited only by available RAM.
* Optional line numbers.
* PRINT USING.
* Modern structured statements, like IF-THEN-ELSE and WHILE-WEND.
* Disk input and output commands.
* Support for types, records and pointers.
* True subroutines and functions, with passed parameters and local
  variables.
* Toolbox access, including good support for user tools.
* Full screen editor.
* Supports ORCA compatible debuggers.

Beta Tester Background
----------------------

Beta testers must have the following minimum background and equipment:

1. A familiarity with BASIC.
2. An Apple IIGS with at least 1.125M of RAM and a hard drive.
3. The ability to download binary attachments to e-mail sent over America
   Online. (You dont need to be on AOL, but beta updates will be sent via
   AOL.)
4. A mailing address in the US or Canada.

Other things that would be a plus are:

1. Already familiar with ORCA languages.
2. Experience at toolbox programming on the Apple IIGS.
3. Experience with pointers and records in Pascal or C.
4. A printer.

What You Will Need to Do
------------------------

As a beta tester, you will be asked to:

1. Read about 300 pages of documentation cover to cover in about 2 weeks,
   making corrections and comments. The annotated pages must be returned to
   the Byte Works.

2. Try the program on your computer, running our test suite.

3. Write at least one small program from scratch. We dont need the program,
   we need your comments on GSoft BASIC as you write it.

4. Send your comments and suggestions to us by e-mail.

What You Will Get
-----------------

We hope you will beta test for the opportunity to shape this new program.
In addition, anyone who sends back annotated documentation pages by mail
and bug reports by e-mail will receive a commercial copy of GSoft BASIC
when it is released, as well as one additional Byte Works product of your
choice with a GS-catalog number.

We will also publicly acknowledge your contributions in the printed
manual--assuming, of course, that we get your comments by the deadline!

Time Table
----------

8 June -- Beta testers will be selected on this date. An initial e-mail
will be made on this date, and the documentation will be sent by mail.

22 June -- Annotated documentation must be mailed back to the Byte Works by
this date. We will supply a prepaid mailer.

29 June -- Feature freeze. All comments and suggestions that require
changes to documentation must be made by this date to stand any chance of
appearing in the initial release.

22 July -- GSoft BASIC will be released at Kansas Fest 98.

Nondisclosure
-------------

Beta testing is a privilege. It is for the benefit of the Byte Works, and
later, for the benefit of people who will use the program. All comments and
opinions about the program must be kept private, shared only with the Byte
Works and the other beta testers, until the planned release date.

Anyone who comments on this program publicly in any way, even to the extent
of announcing they are a beta tester, before 22 July 1998 will be
immediately dropped from the beta test list. They will be asked to return
all materials concerning GSoft BASIC to the Byte Works, and will not
receive a free commercial copy of the program or an additional product.

By applying as a beta tester, you are agreeing to abide by these terms.

Beta Test Application
---------------------

Personal
Name:

Street Address:
City:
State:
Zip Code:

E-mail:

Day Phone:

Apple IIGS Information
ROM number:
RAM:
Hard disk?
Color monitor?
Printer? What kind?

Experience
Do you know BASIC?
Do you know C or Pascal?
Do you know assembly language?
Do you own ORCA/M?
Do you own ORCA/C, ORCA/Pascal or ORCA/Modula-2?
Have you ever written a commercial program?
Name one or two:
Have you ever released a freeware or shareware program?
Name one or two:
Have you written toolbox programs on the Apple IIGS?
Have you been a beta tester for a Byte Works product?
Product name:
Have you been a beta tester for other products?
Name on or two:

Is there anything else we should know about you to help us make our choice?
                       (BYTEWORKS, 13029, GO COM A2)


SQC'S LAST STAND   Below is the inventory of Apple II stuff that Scantron
""""""""""""""""   Quality Computers still has left.  We also have a few
odds and ends of hardware (mostly cables) as well as Appleworks - versions
4.3 and 5.1 available.

ITEM #  DESCRIPTION                                          QTY      COST

35141   Ace Explorer Sequencing                               2       37
43133   African Rainforest IIGS                               1       29
54062   Afterwork Screen Saver                               16       19.95
89608   Amazing Mouse                                         1       27.95
62142   Bake & Taste                                          2       34.95
43011   Beaglewrite Desk Access                              56        6.95
98056   Best of the Internet                                  1        9
55021   Big Book Maker/Fairy Tales                            1       49.95
31174   Billiards & Homonyms                                  2       29.95
34024   Body in Focus                                         3       38
48002   busines works                                         1      112
62168   Chem Aid                                              2       53
39048   Children's Newspaper Maker                            1       39.95
41024   Clip Tunes IIGS                                       3       24
65292   Clock Apple                                           2       26.95
35678   Crosswords & Word Find                                6       15
62061   Crozzzwords Crossword Puzzles                         1       31.95
65298   Dr. Peet's Talk/Writer                                1       49.95
40343   Easy as ABC                                           1       32.95
34170   Exam in a Can/Algebra                                 1      160
52049   EZ Drive                                              2       39.95
46526   Fantasy Land Red                                      1       34.95
46681   Finding Cause and Effect Grade 3                      1       22
46536   Fraction-oids 1                                       1       28.95
53016   Genesys IIGS                                          1       80
36145   Geographic Jigsaw Puzzle                              1       24.95
42634   Granny Applebee's Cookie Factory                      1       34.95
40102   Graphics Disk Labeler                                 7       24
52001   Graphics Exchange                                     1       35
52044   GSOS System 6 disks only                              6       19
52046   GSOS System Dis w/Bundle                             19       39
52093   Hometown USA IIGS                                     1       29
46020   HS Stack - How Bill is law                            1       10
98567   Hugo Hounds Vowels                                    6       29.95
46001   Hyperstudio 3.1                                       1      112.95
46020   "HyperStudio Stack, How Bill into Law"                1       10
64925   "Hyperstudio, Quick Court Template"                   7       39
50101   Jack Nicholas Golf Game                             279       19.95
40092   Jack Nicholas Golfe Course #3                       287       10
50092   Jack Nicholas Golfe Course #4                        99       10
46518   Kinder Critters                                       8       24.95
46643   "Kittens, Kids & Frogs"                               1       47.95
43113   Lockout Apple IIGS                                   11       39.95
35120   Make a Flash 525                                      1       44.95
46652   Making Inferences - Grade 5                           1       22
56671   Managing a Checking Acct.                             1       44
56067   Math Gulper                                           1       24.95
89603   Math Gulper                                           1       24.95
96411   Math Shop Fractions                                   2       59.95
96403   Math Shop Jr.                                         4       59.95
96405   Math Shop Jr.                                        12       59.95
45624   Math Word Problems Travel                             1       39.95
39003   McGee at the Fun Fair GS                              1       29.95
39002   McGee GS                                              1       29.95
53010   Micol Advanced Basic                                  3      109
40097   MiniPix 1                                             7       14.95
40098   MiniPix 2                                            10       14.95
40099   MiniPix 3                                             3       14.95
89481   My Words                                              1       44.95
39343   Once Upon a Time #3                                   1       34.95
35721   Once Upon a Time II                                   1       36.95
35722   Once Upon a Time III                                  2       34.95
35730   Once Upon a Time Playhouse                            2       36.95
39333   Once upon a time puppet                              12        9
62827   "Once Upon a Time Triple Pk,."                        8       32.95
96452   Operation Frog                                       10       29.95
39231   Orange Cherry Roman                                   1       32
54039   Outliner                                             16       42.95
41318   Plantinum Paint Activity Guide                        2       24.95
61001   Point to Point                                        7       59.95
42646   Pondering Problems Grade 4                            1       19.95
52322   Prime Suspect Reading                                 1       29.95
89605   Process Wrot4er                                       8       79.95
62070   Prodos Update Disk                                   26        9.95
52038   Program Writer                                        5       32.95
41315   QC Fong Pak #3                                        7       19.95
41313   QC Font Pack                                         11       19
41314   QC Font Pak #2                                        6       19.95
52051   QC Public Domain                                      4       12
40125   Quality Print Shop Graphics                           1        8
63022   Quarter Mile - Decimals & Percents                    1       39.95
63030   Quarter Mile - Value Set                              1      144.95
63061   Quarter Mile 4.0                                      1       41.95
63018   Quarter Mile Fractions                                1       39.95
63063   Quarter Mile Whole #'s                                1       41.95
52048   RamUp                                                12       10
65297   Reading for Meaning 2                                 1       32.95
54043   Repairworks                                          13       19.95
42588   Rescue in the Outback                                 1       45
89599   Rudy Reader                                           1       19.95
52042   Second Chance                                         2       19
62655   Shop Right!                                           8       33
52040   Signature GS                                          1       29.95
39071   Space Shuttle Word Prob.                              1       29
56020   Spell It Plus                                        17        1
39326   Storybook Weeaver                                     1       47.95
89595   Success with Writing                                  8       79.95
28411   SuperFonts Fonts Disk                                27        0
96340   Superprint II                                         2       79.95
52073   Switch Hitter                                         9       29.95
60006   Symbols & Slogans                                     1       29
52360   System 6.0.1 w/addendum                              68       19.95
39073   Talking Clock                                         2       39.95
39063   Talking Colors & Shapes                               5       39.95
39081   Talking First Reader                                  5       39.95
39087   Talking First Words                                   1       29
39088   Talking First Words                                   2       42
39041   Talking Jungle Safari                                 1       42
39069   Talking Multiplication & Div                          1       39.95
39052   Talking School Bus                                    1       39.95
56027   Talking Sensible Speller                              3      109.95
39054   Talking USA Map                                       1       39.95
98569   Teacher's Puzzle Center                               1       79.95
35360   The Bubblegum Machine                                 6       29.95
38380   The Coin Changer                                      8       29.95
31170   The Electric Coloring Book                            3       39.95
36233   The Oregon Trail                                     14       39.95
52060   The Presenter                                         3       42
33301   The Ugly Duckling IIGS                               34       10
56665   The Word Problem Game Show                            1       44
54060   TO Grammar                                            2       49.95
54008   TO Power Pack                                        22       32.95
54009   TO QuickSpell                                         5       40.95
54018   TO SF Activity                                        8       32.95
54081   TO Shrinkit Plus                                      1       19.95
54012   TO Spreadtools                                        9       40.95
54013   TO Superfonts                                         4       42.95
54014   TO SuperForms                                         9       42.95
54017   TO Text Tools                                         9       32.95
54019   TO Thesaurus                                          1       32.95
54020   TO UltraMacros 3.1                                    4       40.95
38381   Tommy the Time Turtle                                 2       29.95
52039   Triple Dump                                          16       29.95
98566   Uncle Clyde Consonants                                6       39.95
33230   Woolly Bounce                                         1       39.95
54255   Woolly's Garden                                       1       39.95
31173   Word Capture                                          2       29.95
83688   Word Zapper                                          14       29.95


It looks like it may have come out a little twisted.  The first number
after the title is the quantity, and the 2nd number is the cost.  If it's
has no .xx after it, it's an even dollar amount.  Hope you can read this.
If you can't, please say so!

Gina
Tech Support

PS  THERE WILL BE NO TECH SUPPORT on the above items.  They are sold as-is
(they are new product, however).  Tech support on them can be gleaned from
either here and/or your local user group or another Apple II expert in your
area.

Gina
                        (GSAIKIN, 13312, GO COM A2)


NINJAFORCE MOVES TO A NEW VIRTUAL HOME
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
=================
IMPORTANT NOTICE:
=================

NINJAFORCE, the makers of various Apple IIGS programs, including the
Ninjaforce MEGADEMO and the upcoming KABOOM! have moved to a new web-page:

http://www.ninjaforce.home.ml.org

While the old address will still be in effect, we highly recommend that you
update your bookmarks to our new link.

Many greetings,

Jesse Blue & Clue / Ninjaforce

Check out our upcoming Apple IIGS game at:
http://www.ninjaforce.home.ml.org
                       (JESSEBLUE, 13316, GO COM A2)


A2 WEBRING UPDATE   The Mother of All Apple II Web Rings welcomes Nick
"""""""""""""""""   Heywood to the fold - when you have a moment, check out
Nick's neat concept on how to visually present a web page in a manner
familiar to any Apple II user.

Here is the complete list of all who have joined the Apple II Web Ring:

     *  A2-Web -- http://www.syndicomm.com/a2web/
     *  The A2 Forum on Delphi -- http://www.delphi.com/apple2
     *  The Rhode Island Apple Group Home Page --
        http://www.wbwip.com/riag/
     *  The Apple II Programmers Forum on Delphi --
        http://www.delphi.com/a2pro
     *  The AppleWorks Gazette -- http://www.wbwip.com/tag/
     *  Apple II Software -- http://www.iglou.com/qwerty/kb/dlfiles.html
     *  Marinetti Home Page -- http://www.zip.com.au/~kashum/marinetti
     *  Applebyters of the Quad Cities --
        http://helios.augustana.edu/~sbeattie/applebyters/
     *  The GNO Consortium -- http://www.gno.org
     *  Trenco Apple II FTP Archive -- http://www.gno.org/a2ftp.html
     *  Treasure Chest Project --
        http://www.tals.dis.qut.edu.au/staff/willie/treasurechest/
     *  Shareware Solutions II -- http://www.crl.com/~joko
     *  The Apple II Information Resource -- http://www.apple2.org
     *  Official Home Page of The Lamp! --
        http://www.sheppyware.ml.org/~rsuenaga
     *  Annies Craft,Inc. -- http://www.anniescraft.com/
     *  apple II World -- http://www.gingin.ne.jp/~sckop/apple2/index.html
     *  The Juiced.GS Home Page! -- http://www.wbwip.com/juiced.gs/
     *  Aurora Area Apple Core -- http://people.delphi.com/hkatz/aaac.html
     *  KFest Homepage -- http://www.primenet.com/~adams/kfest.html
     *  Speccie's Home Pages --
        http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/
     *  Bret's IIgs software -- http://www.cco.caltech.edu/~bret/iigs.html
     *  Apple // Resources --
        http://www.iversonsoftware.com/cgi-bin/apple2.cgi
     *  Net Parlour -- http://locals.onslowonline.net/~cracked/index.html
     *  Brutal Deluxe Software Home Page --
        http://www.cyberstation.fr/~zardini
     *  Jim Sassman's Homepage -- http://www.binary.net/jsassman/
     *  alphalink -- http://www.alphalink.com.au/~nickh

 {<http://www.syndicomm.com/a2web/a2webring.html> Join the Apple II Web
Ring!}

David K.
                       (DKERWOOD, 13692, GO COM A2)


HARDPRESSED RE-RELEASED AS FREEWARE BY AUTHOR   According to his post,
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   HardPressed can be
downloaded from the A2 Files section on his web site  http://www.fadden.com

Dave Miller                  Assistant Chief Sysop, A2Pro on Delphi & Genie
http://www2.c4systm.com/~dmiller   justdave@delphi.com  just.dave@genie.com
                       (JUSTDAVE, 13310, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I just got email from Andy McFadden saying it's okay to upload
"""""   HardPressed here and on Genie. I'll upload HardPressed this
weekend, and maybe some of the other goodies. If someone else beats me to
it, all the better.

 -----------------------------------------------------
 Tony Ward, A2 Database Manager
 [Delivered with Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5]
 --
 Well feed me bran and call me irregular!
                        (TONYW1, 13330, GO COM A2)



                             BEST OF THE BEST
                             """"""""""""""""


13498 21-JUN 20:04 General Chatter
     RE: Save The Apple IIgs Page (Re: Msg 13494)
     From: T_DIAZ       To: GUDATH


Gus, Shmus! I'm sorry. But I've had it with it.

Yes, it was worked on by Apple engineers who have the Apple ][ at heart.
Fine. Yes, it was worked on in spare time, then some official time, then
banished then worked on again, etc. it's had a hard life.

But, to say many times, we're 24 hours from a new release, and then come up
with some totally off the wall reason as to why it's not 'ready'. Talk
about carrot-ware.

Oh, yes, I know strange things can and do happen. I mean, look at Apple.
They actually shipped a PowerBook that should have been labeled as a
PowerBomb. Capable of bringing down a commercial jetliner in a panic.
Someone please tell me, did they ever actually plug one in and charge the
battery? I can't belive that got past testing.

I Support Bernie 100%, and then some. Take your Apple ][ wherever you want
to go, and as fast as you get there.

"There's a little ][ in everything we do".

Woof Woof!

Tony




[EOA]
[A2P]------------------------------
                   A2Pro_DUCTIVITY |
-----------------------------------
Checking out A2PRO on Delphi
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W.
                    [thelamp@delphi.com]


3D RENDERING   Well, depending on whether you want just a basic formula for
""""""""""""   plotting three dimensional points onto a two dimensional
display (this I can give you but it only really works for line drawings,
you need more code to fill polygons or do texturing), this subject would
take an awful lot of space to discuss.

However, if anyone would like to teach a course on 3D
rendering/animation/whatever, please let me know. :)

Jeff Blakeney
Dean of A2U
                       (JBLAKENEY, 1795, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   It would take quite a bit of space to cover 3D rendering properly.
"""""   There are several good books that do it, though.

Depending on your needs, you might be able to use 3D Logo. It uses a 3D
version of turtle graphics--you feed it 3D movement information, and it
takes care of all of the scaling for you. It even features a red/blue dual
drawing mode that, when viewed through 3D glasses (included), shows the
image in true 3D!

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 1797, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   The best reference for this kind of stuff is _Computer Graphics:
"""""   Principles and Practice_ by Foley & van Dam. ISBN # on my copy is
0-201-12110-7. Also the _Graphics Gems_ series volumes 1-5 can be useful.

   Proper 3D rendering is a lot of math, preferably floating point, but can
be cheezed on the GS with fixed point. Unless it's really needed, spend the
processing time and power on other things.

Nathan Mates
                         (NMATES, 1798, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   I've read the Foley & van Dam book and it is quite good.
"""""   Unfortunately, now it is more of a primer to teach the basics.
There are so many new and better algorithms in use today it is always a
good idea to get a more recent book in addition to Foley & van Dam.

For instance I have a book that also covers more advanced subjects like
ray-tracing and radiosity but doesn't talk much about the basic principles
covered in Foley & van Dam. Knowledge of the basics is assumed.

>    Proper 3D rendering is a lot of math, preferably floating
> point, but can be cheezed on the GS with fixed point.
> Unless it's really needed, spend the processing time and
> power on other things.

Very true. I've also thought that the fill mode of the VGC would help speed
up drawing as well but I haven't really tried it yet. Too busy with other
stuff.

Jeff Blakeney
                       (JBLAKENEY, 1800, GO COM A2)


SCHEMATICS FOR OLDER II'S   The original 'white' Apple II reference, and
"""""""""""""""""""""""""   the even more distant and rare 'red book', both
have a fold out full schematic for the Apple II.

There was also a 'SAMS' trouble-shooting reference guide published way
back.

The original II had 3 Integer Basic ROMS and one monitor ROM leaving one
blank ROM socket. The later II+ had 4 Floating Point Basic ROMS and an
autostart monitor ROM in the five holders.

There were some variants on the boards over the years, but it was mainly
only a matter of the memory addressing header blocks, the character
generator chip, and one or two extra chips added later. The general
schemetic works for all the boards.

And you are right in saying that it is filled with 74 series chips... But
if there is no video and sound, then it may not actually be starting up.

With any venerable Apple II, the first thing you should do is remove all
the chips one by one, and clean the pins with a glass fiber eraser or a
typewriter hard eraser. That gets 99% of dead Apple II's going...

If it still does not work, then you may have some dead chips. The usual
cause of this is that someone tried to remove a card while the machine was
switched on. That can kill any number of chips anywhere on the board. The
worst I ever had was one of the FP Basic chips that got fried. At the time.
the Apple II was still in production so I was able to get a replacement, at
great cost!

Good luck, and keep us all posted to how you get on...

 Ewen Wannop - Speccie
 Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5!
 Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120
 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/
                        (EWANNOP, 1855, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   As Ewen pointed out, there are a number of sources. Here's one that
"""""   has the advantage that I can tell you where to get a copy. :)

Understanding the Apple II
Jim Sather
Quality Software

We still have these for $14.95. We charge $5 shipping per order in the US
and Canada. The books are new (or at least have never been sold!). They
include schematics and quite a bit of other information for the hobiest,
including maintenance tips with typical problems and solutions.

I'll be traveling a lot this month, but if you're in no rush, e-mail me and
I'll send you our price list or a printed catalog, whichever you prefer. If
you're in a rush, you can call Patty at our office; she can ship one out to
you, but may not be able to help with technical questions.

Mike Westerfield
Byte Works, Inc.
(505) 898-8183
                       (BYTEWORKS, 1904, GO COM A2)


GS/OS DIRECTORY STORAGE TYPE   I was looking at some of my old directory
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   traversal code, and I had made a note that
occasionally the GS/OS Open call was returning a storage type of $0E for
ProDOS subdirectories.  According to the GS/OS Reference, its only supposed
to return $0D or $0F for directories.  Has anyone else seen this? I'm
guessing this is using System 6.0 or 6.0.1.

--
Steve Reeves
                        (REEVESST, 1860, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   The only storageType values I've seen are 0x01, 0x05, 0x0D, and
"""""   0x0F. Page 175 of the GS/OS reference doesn't list 0x0F, so I
annotated my book with that value.  (0x0F is used for volume directories
rather than subdirectories.)

Perhaps 0x0E was a transcription of a sloppy 0x0F?  ie, a typo?

Devin
                       (GLYNREADE, 1864, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Steve,
"""""
Do you have any sample code?

None of the documentation (TBRs, Sys refs, GS/OS ref) refer to such a
storage type, but I seem to remember something about an $0E.

Got any code we can look at?

Regards,
 Richard
                       (RICHARD_B, 1866, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Storage type $0E is used for subdirectory header entries.
"""""

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                         (SHEPPY, 1867, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   So I would guess that the code incorrectly starts at entry $0000
"""""   instead of $0001. Interesting. I didn't realise GetDirEntry could
return the header entry.

Regards,
 Richard
                       (RICHARD_B, 1868, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I'm not sure that GetDirEntry does return the subdirectory header
"""""   entry (in fact, I don't think it does).

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                         (SHEPPY, 1870, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Interesting. The GS/OS ref indicates you should start at $0001, but
"""""   it doesn't mention what happens if you use $0000. I haven't time to
test it right now, but perhaps it does.

Regards,
 Richard
                       (RICHARD_B, 1872, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I seem to recall getting an error when I accidentally used $0000
"""""   for the index.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                         (SHEPPY, 1874, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   GetDirEntry doesn't return the storage type, only Open and
"""""   GetFileInfo do.

$0E only gets returned rarely, so I wonder if it is a cache issue.  Maybe
the subdirectory header is in the cache, but the parent directory isn't, so
the FST gets the information from the subdirectory header.

--
Steve Reeves
                        (REEVESST, 1878, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I don't have my Beneath Apple ProDOS handy (it's packed in a box -
"""""   I'm in the middle of moving) but if I recall correctly from there,
$0F is the header entry for a volume, $0E is the header entry for a
subdirectory, and $0D is the file entry pointing to a subdirectory.

Dave Miller                  Assistant Chief Sysop, A2Pro on Delphi & Genie
http://www2.c4systm.com/~dmiller  justdave@delphi.com   just.dave@genie.com
                        (JUSTDAVE, 1883, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Yep.  Description on page 4-10 in my copy of Beneath Apple ProDOS,
"""""   with examples on 4-13 and 4-29.

- Aaron
                        (APULVER, 1885, GO COM A2)


TRENCO.GNO.ORG--MAJOR A2 FTP SITE IN THE MAKING   As many people know, the
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   GNO Consortium is now
providing a general Apple II ftp archive.  There are policies in place
regarding piracy and similiar issues.  The url is

        ftp://ftp.gno.org/pub/apple2
        http://www.gno.org

There is an /incoming directory, and (non-pirated) uploads are fine. If you
have questions regarding the policies, there is a policy document available
for download or web viewing.

Devin
                       (GLYNREADE, 1863, GO COM A2)


SPREADSHEETS ON DEMAND   I have a project in mind that I've been wanting to
""""""""""""""""""""""   do for quite some time (years!). I've started it
many times, and actually made progress, but would hit a programming snag
that would prevent me from making it "perfect" (or as close a perfect can
be in the programming world! ;-) ). It would then slip to the back-burner,
and then sooner or later I would take another crack at it, having the same
results.

I've now 'bragged' at work that I can do this, and they've saddled me with
the project. I'm not on a real tight time frame to finish this project, but
I would like to start making some real progress on it. I imagine that,
since I'm no programmer, this will seem a simple task to most here, but
would appreciate any help. I considered posting this in A2, but feel that
it belongs here. If someone disagrees, I'll be happy to move it to A2.

The issue, in its' simpleist description, is creating a spreadsheet that
calculates time worked, money earned for that time, etc. The interface
needs to be simple enough where any user, computer illiterate or not, can
simply enter the start time and end time of a shift in decimal form (i.e.
8.2 starting time = 08:12 in real time).

At work, I'm using MS Excel (since I don't have a choice), but for the
purpose here, any A2gs spreadsheet program will be fine. I'd prefer using
"Quick Clic Calc", but would settle on AWGS Spreadsheet module (although I
don't really trust it!).

Here are the issues. Since all of the items needed (with clear
descriptions) will not fit on this screen, I'll list all of the columns
needed that I have already created...

Name, Status, Scheduled Shift Start, Scheduled Shift End, Actual Shift
Start, Actual Shift End, Staight Time, Overtime, Doubletime, Total time,
OT/DT Approved By:, Shift Premium, Lead, General Foreman, High Pay, Lunch
time, Penalty time, Money due for Penalty, Comments.

These all seem simple entries at first glance, but most of them imply
various "background" calculations that can get quite complex.

So, my question is, is this an appropriate place for this type of
discussion? Shall I proceed with an explanation of problems that I've not
been able to resolve?

Thanks for listening,



Jeff Carr

Cruising the 'rainbow' path provided by:
Spectrum v2.1 and Crock O' Gold v2.5
                        (LUMITECH, 1873, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I'll list the 'Columns' needed again, define them, and then one can
"""""   refer back to them as needed...


Name, Status, Scheduled Shift Start, Scheduled Shift End, Actual Shift
Start, Actual Shift End, Staight Time, Overtime, Doubletime, Total time,
OT/DT Approved By:, Shift Premium, Lead, General Foreman, High Pay, Lunch
time, Penalty time, Money due for Penalty, Comments.


Name = Employee Name
       To eventually be put into a lookup table, but for now can be
       ignored.

Status = 02 (highest) to 08 (lowest) with a 'no entry' being a temporary
         employee. This could be part of the 'Name' lookup table, but I
         need it displayed in a separate column. This also determines the
         'Base Rate of Pay', probably needed in a lookup table.

Scheduled Shift Start = Scheduled Start Time for the named employee.
                        Frequently, shifts change at the last moment, hence
                        the requirement for 'Actual Shift Start'. The entry
                        format needs to be in decimal form, i.e. "8.2"
                        equals 08:12am, 23.0 = 11:00pm, etc.

Scheduled Shift End = Same requirements as 'Scheduled Shift Start' above.

Actual Shift Start = Same requirements as 'Scheduled Shift Start' above.

Actual Shift End = Same requirements as 'Scheduled Shift Start' above.

Straight Time (ST) = Total time between 'Shift Start' and 'Shift End' after
                subtracting 'Lunch Time' (below) from the total. If there
                are no entries in the 'Actual' fields, then the 'Scheduled'
                fields are assumed. Also, if the total exceeds '8.0' hours,
                the remainder needs to list in the 'OT' column. If the 'OT'
                column exceeds '4.0' hours, the remainder needs to list in
                the 'DT' column.

Overtime (OT) = Any 'time' that exceeds 8.0 hours in the 'ST' column.
           Again, if the 'OT' column exceeds 4.0 hours, the remainder
           goes to the 'DT' column.

Doubeltime (DT) = Any 'time' that exceeds 4.0 hours in the 'OT' column.

Total Time (TT) = Totals of 'ST', 'OT', and 'DT', again, in decimal format.

OT/DT Approved By: = Initials of a particular supervisor, provided by a
                     'lookup' table.

Shift Premium = If equal to '1', no premium if between the hours of 5.0 to
                15.9. If equal to '2', a premium of $.25 is used between
                the hours of 16.0 to 21.9. If equal to '3', a premium of
                $.40 is used between the hours of 22.0 to 5.0. Again, if
                'Actual Start Time' is empty, then 'Scheduled Start
                Time' is assumed. These rates should probably go into a
                lookup table also, as these rates change with each new
                contract (about every 3 years).

Lead = A $.75 premium/hour is paid for all hours listed in this column.
       (A lookup table again?)

General Foreman = A $1.15 premium/hour is paid for all hours listed in
                  in this column. (A lookup table again?)

High Pay = Think of this as 'danger' pay. A $2.40 premium/hour is paid for
           all hours listed in this column. (A lookup table again?)

Lunch Time = A column to notate how long the employee was on lunch, to be
             deducted from the 'ST' column before listing.

Penalty Time = If this entry is empty, no penalty time was permitted. If
               this column has an entry, $20/hr added for each .5/hr
               listed.

Money Due for Penalty = Total of calculation from the 'Penalty Time'
                        column. (A lookup table again?)

Comments = Simply a field to enter explanation if any of the above does not
           meet the criteria, i.e. if 'Scheduled Start Time' does not match
           the 'Actual Start Time' (if an employee is 'late', 'sick',
           went home early, etc.).


This should easily get us started. ;-) Perhaps the way to approach this is
'one-by-one'. The name and status columns =probably= require a large
'lookup' table, so let's skip that for now. The area I've had the most
problems with is letting the computer do the time calculations accurately.

To explain, let me point out where I've stumbled in trying to make this
work. One would initially think that a simple '=sum(End Time - Start Time)'
would generate the proper entry in ST; in many cases it would, i.e. End
Time = 23.5 and Start Time = 15.0, then ST = 8.0 after subtracting .5 for
lunch. However, if the employee's Start Time = 23.0 and their End Time =
06.5, then a negative number is realized, leaving the =very= poor employee
owing money to the employer!

So, if agreed, can we work on this problem first? I've =toyed= with using
'ABS' in the spreadsheet to avoid the negative number, but I continue to
get inconsistent totals. If I were using Basic, I'd write it like this...

Let X = Start Time
Let Y = End Time
If X>Y then ST=X-Y : ST=Y-X
ST=ST - Lunch Time
If ST>8.0 then OT=ST-8.0 : ST=8.0 : If OT>4.0 then DT=OT-4.0 : OT=4.0
TT=ST+OT+DT

Keep in mind that the above calculation is based on 'Scheduled Start/End
Times' =unless= 'Actual Start/End Times' are entered. If there are entries
in the 'Actual' columns, then the 'Scheduled' columns are ignored.

Now, help me get that into a spreadsheet calculation and we'll move onto
some more interesting 'logic' fiascos!



Jeff Carr

Cruising the 'rainbow' path provided by:
Spectrum v2.1 and Crock O' Gold v2.5
                        (LUMITECH, 1891, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Since you are using 24 hr. time, shouldn't be too hard.
"""""
1.) First we need to figure out the total time worked, using either
scheduled time or actual time. Ideally the formula would be like this: (in
pseudo-AWGS SpreadSheet format)

=If( IsEmpty( actual time ),( =If( sched end > sched start, sched end -
sched start - lunch , 24 - sched start + sched end - lunch)),( =If( actual
end > actual start, actual end - actual start - lunch, 24 - sched start +
sched end - Lunch)))

But since AWGS can't handle the nested functions, it needs to be broken
down into multiple cells.


Total time cell function:
note: replace actual start, temp sched & temp actual with relative cells

 =If(IsEmpty(actual start), temp sched, temp actual)


temp sched cell function:
note: replace sched end, sched start & lunch with relative cells

 =If(sched end > sched start, sched end - sched start - lunch, 24 - sched
start + sched end)


temp actual cell function:
note: replace actual end, actual start & lunch with relative cells

 =If(actual end > actual start, actual end - actual start - lunch, 24 -
actual start + actual end)


note: when a shift crosses the 24 hr boundry, subtract start time from 24,
then add the end time. example  start 23.5; end 8.0 subtract 23.5 from 24
gives you .5, then add 8.0 gives you 8.5, then subtract .5 for lunch and
you have 8.0 hrs worked.

Once you have total time figured, it is easy to figure ST, OT and DT.

 =If(total time > 8.0, 8.0, total time) will give you ST.

You can do OT and DT.

See ya.

HABANERO
                        (HABANERO, 1893, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I happen to have a spreedsheet in ***** (um, it's evil, so I won't
"""""   say which program :)   that does time calculations on hours worked
crossing midnight. Mine is mostly for scheduling, rather than payroll, but
the concept is the same...

In this example, C7 is the start time, and C8 is the end time...  I let the
spreadsheet software do the time conversions to and from decimal, as I have
the format of those cells set so I type in real times with the colon in the
middle.

The place of business I use this to write schedules for requires a half
hour lunch if an employee works more than 5 hours, so it will subtract a
half hour from the total if there's more than 5 hours.  If cell B9 contains
"NL" it means that employee was authorized to not have to take lunches, so
it doesn't subtract the half hour in that case.  It does correct for having
the shift cross midnight...

=IF(OR(ISBLANK(C7), ISBLANK(C8)), "", IF(C8 >= C7, IF(OR((C8 - C7) <=
TIMEVALUE("5:00"), $B9 = "NL"), C8 - C7, C8 - C7 - TIMEVALUE("0:30")),
IF(OR((C8 + 1) - C7 <= TIMEVALUE("5:00"), $B9 = "NL"), (C8 + 1)-C7,
(C8+1)-C7-TIMEVALUE("0:30"))))

If I remove the half hour lunch thing, so all we're looking at is
correcting for a shift crossing midnight, it leaves this:

=IF(OR(ISBLANK(C7), ISBLANK(C8)), "", IF(C8 >= C7, C8 - C7, (C8 + 1)-C7))

C8 + 1 in this case is because the software in question records time as a
fraction of a day, so adding 1 to the end time is the equivalent of adding
24 hours to the end time.

Dave Miller                  Assistant Chief Sysop, A2Pro on Delphi & Genie
http://www2.c4systm.com/~dmiller  justdave@delphi.com   just.dave@genie.com
                        (JUSTDAVE, 1898, GO COM A2)


>>>>>   "But since AWGS can't handle the nested functions, it needs to be
"""""    broken down into multiple cells."

I haven't had any problems getting AWGS to do nested functions.  Just drop
the = signs.  The function isn't =IF(), it's IF().  The = is there so it
knows that cell contains a formula and not a value.

Dave Miller                  Assistant Chief Sysop, A2Pro on Delphi & Genie
http://www2.c4systm.com/~dmiller  justdave@delphi.com   just.dave@genie.com
                        (JUSTDAVE, 1903, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Right you are. The ='s were left there as a mistake when I cut and
"""""   pasted into Crock o' Gold.  <Sigh>, quick hacks at 04:00 can lead
to many mistakes and your message made me go back and try my original
formula again. It wasn't that AWGS couldn't handle the nested functions (as
the error message lead me to believe) it was a typo on my part, mismatched
()'s on one of the nested If's, <slap> d'oh! The REAL formula goes into the
Total Time cell like this:


=If(IsEmpty(e3),If(d3>c3,d3-c3-p3,24-c3+d3-p3),If(f3>e3,f3-e3-p3,24-e3+f3-p
3))


where c3 = sched start, d3 = sched end, e3 = actual start, f3 = actual end
and p3 = lunch. This would be typed into cell j3, which would be total time
per Jeff's specs.

Anybody reading my original post, ignore the part about having to split it
into multiple cells, although that works too :o)

HABANERO
                        (HABANERO, 1905, GO COM A2)




[EOA]
[KFE]------------------------------
                    THINKING KFEST |
-----------------------------------
KANSASFEST ON THE WEB
"""""""""""""""""""""
by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W.
                    [thelamp@delphi.com]


                              A VIRTUAL KFEST
                             ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

     Steve Gozdziewski, also known as Steve Godzilla, has spent his spare
time the last three years helping to organize KansasFest.  Painstakingly he
has etched out schedule of events after schedule of events and dealt with
last minute cancellations, mid-stream additions, and all manner of
calamity.  A thankless job indeed, as it is unlikely there has ever been a
KFest schedule everyone has been happy with, yet, he says today the same
thing he did after his first KFest: "I want every Apple II user to come to
KansasFest, at least once."

     An ambitious goal for sure, and one I share in as well, but
unquestionably there will likely always be the person who for some reason
or another never makes it to Avila's hallowed halls.  While the Apple II
advocate in me screams out to tell you to do whatever you can to come,
there will always be those who cannot make it.  If you fall into this
category, what's the next best thing?

     The answer: KansasFest on the web!

     There are several sites on the World Wide Web which promote or review
or otherwise provide coverage of the Apple II event of the year.  If you're
stuck at home in mid-July rather than sweating it out in Kansas City,
perhaps viewing these sites will satisfy your Apple II urge for this year.

     The Official KansasFest Web Page lives at:

     http://www.primenet.com/~adams/kfest.html

     You'll find all the basics of KFest information right here, from where
to sign up (and an online sign up form) to dates, locations, names, mailing
list info. . . you name it, it's right here.  David Kerwood, the prodigious
DiveMaster, is the webmaster for this site.

     While it's well-known that KFest attendees tend to only use the word
"sleep" followed by the words "what's that", many people don't realize that
in addition to having fun, real work is taking place.  The aforementioned
David Kerwood spent much of his time at the last two KFests giving updated
reports to the world at large via the A2-Web page.  The URL for viewing
these is:

     http://www.syndicomm.com/a2web/kfest.html

     One of the real Kansans who finally made his way to KFest this past
year was Kirk Mitchell, a member of the A2 Geek Gang.  Kirk had so much fun
at KFest '97 he took a bunch of pictures with his digital camera and
uploaded them to his Web page, then got blatantly plugged in the major
Apple II publications, so he spruced things up a little.  You can see his
work at:

     http://moscow2.pld.com/kfest97/

     Geoff Weiss was relatively anonymous back at KFest '96, before he
became relatively famous as the co-author of _Spectrum Internet Suite_, the
seed of which was planted at Avila College.  Prior to _SIS_ making it out
the door, Geoff wrote a review of KansasFest '96 and posted it on his Web
page.  Check it out at:

     http://www.gwlink.net/geoff/kf96.html

     There are other KFest Web pages around the world, for sure, as well as
reviews in the Apple II publications (including _GenieLamp A2_).  And there
is always fun mail on the KFest Mailing List, which we've discussed in this
column in the past.  If you're looking for more KFest on the World Wide
Web, I suggest you use the links from the pages above.  If you choose to,
you can use an Internet search engine like snap.com; searching on the term
"kansasfest" will net you much better results than searching on "kfest".

     Finally, I'd like to remind you that the best virtual KFest is not
virtual at all--it's actually being at Avila to see hardware that was never
made, programs that could never be done, and celebrate the computer that
started it all: the Apple II.  Join us while you still can.  Every KFest
needs to be treated like it's the last--celebrate the Apple II like there's
no tomorrow.  Apple II Forever!







         :: DISCUSSED ON DELPHI ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
         :                                                       :
         :         When in doubt, make it configurable.          :
         :                                                       :
         :::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: GOLDFISCHE :::



[EOA]
[INN]------------------------------
                     EXTRA INNINGS |
-----------------------------------
About The Lamp!   The Lamp! is published on the fifteenth of every month in
"""""""""""""""   the Database of the II Scribe Forum on the Delphi online
service (GO CUS 11).

This publication produced entirely with real or emulated Apple II computers
using Appleworks 5.1 and Hermes.  Apple II Forever!

     * The Lamp! is (c) copyright 1998 by Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W.  All
       rights reserved.

     * To reach The Lamp! on Internet email send mail to
       thelamp@delphi.com.

     * Back issues of The Lamp! are available in the II Scribe Forum on
       Delphi as well as The Lamp! Home Page,
       http://lamp.sheppyware.net.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Opinions expressed herein are those of  the individual authors, and do  not
necessarily  represent  the  opinions   of  the  Delphi  Online   Services,
Syndicomm, Inc.,  or  Ryan M.  Suenaga.     Forum  messages  are  reprinted
verbatim and  are included  in this  publication with  permission from  the
individual authors.   Delphi Online Services,  Syndicomm, Inc. and  Ryan M.
Suenaga  do not guarantee  the accuracy or  suitability of any  information
included herein.  We reserve the right to edit all letters and copy.

Material published  in  this  edition  may not  be  reprinted  without  the
expressed  written consent  of the  publisher.   Registered  computer  user
groups, not  for profit  publications ,  and other  interested parties  may
write the publisher to apply for permission to reprint any or all material.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<



[EOF]

