[HEA]
    _____________________   ___                                   _
    |___   ______________| |   |                                 | |
        |  | _             |   |                                 | |
        |  || |            |   |                                 | |
        |  || |            |   |                                 | |
        |  || |            |   |   ____ _   _ _   _   ______     | |
        |  || |            |   |  / __ \ | | / \_/ \  | ___ \    | |
        |  || |__   ____   |   | / /  \  | |  /\ /\ \ | |  \ \   | |
        |  ||  _ \ |  _ \  |   | \ \__/  | | | |_|| | | |__/ /   | |
        |  || | | || |_||  |   |  \___/|_| |_|    |_| | ____/    |_|
        |  || | | || |__   |   |____________________  | |         _
        |__||_| |_|\____/  |________________________| | |        |_|
                                                      | |
         Lighting Your Apple II Path On Delphi        | |
                                                      |_|

                       >>> WELCOME TO THE LAMP! <<<
                       ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                        FREEWARE FAVORITES: Quit-To
              AND THE BEST OF THE A2 AND A2PRO MESSAGE BOARDS
            "Teaching the Apple II user how to fish since 1998"

 ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
 The Lamp!            An Onipa'a Software Production       Vol. 1, No. 10
 ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
 Publisher & Editor.......................Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W., L.S.W.
 Internet Email........................................thelamp@delphi.com
 ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::

                             TABLE OF CONTENTS
                             ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
                             October 15, 1998


OPENING PITCH
     Never Mind The iMac, Here's The iIgs --------------------------- [OPN]

A FUNNY THING HAPPENED                                                [FOR]
     The Heat Is On ------------------------------------------------- [HET]
     Miscellanea                                                      [MSC]
     Rumor Mill ----------------------------------------------------- [RMR]
     Public Postings                                                  [PUB]
     Best Of The Best ----------------------------------------------- [BOB]

A2Pro_DUCTIVITY
     Checking out A2PRO on Delphi ----------------------------------- [A2P]

FREEWARE FAVORITES
     Quit-TO -------------------------------------------------------- [FRE]

EXTRA INNINGS
     About The Lamp! ------------------------------------------------ [INN]

                                [*] [*] [*]

READING THE LAMP!   The index system used by The Lamp! is designed to make
"""""""""""""""""   your reading easier.  To use this system, load this
issue into any word processor or text editor.  In the index you will find
something like:

EXTRA INNINGS
     About The Lamp! ------------------------------------------------ [INN]

To read this article, simply use your search or find command to locate
[INN].  There is a similar tag at the end of each article: [EOA].


         :: DISCUSSED ON DELPHI ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
         :                                                       :
         :    A little inaccuracy saves a lot of explanation.    :
         :                                                       :
         ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: TONYW1 ::::::::


[EOA]
[OPN]------------------------------
                     OPENING PITCH |
-----------------------------------
From The Editor
"""""""""""""""
by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W.
                    [thelamp@delphi.com]

                   NEVER MIND THE iMAC, HERE'S THE iIGS
                   ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

     Our old friends at Apple Computer, Inc. made quite a stir when they
brought out the _iMac_.  Wildly popular and at least as controversial, the
_iMac_ is, if nothing else, a very different kind of computer.  More like
the "appliance" that The Rest Of Them have been wanting since 1984, and
designed from the bottom up for the Internet.

     The Apple II has never had the sex appeal or the controversy of the
Macintosh, particularly its newest member, and it wasn't designed for the
Internet, because the Internet as we know it didn't exist when the Apple II
was designed.  What the Apple II was designed for, from the bottom up, was
versatility, and in 1998 it was that very versatility that brought the
Apple II someplace that didn't even exist in 1977.

     In late September, _Marinetti 2.0_ arrived for the eagerly waiting
Apple II community, proving once again, even though it couldn't be done, it
was done.

     We may never create the splash that Apple Computer, Inc. does with our
Apple II's, but once again, we're on common ground.

     Apple II Forever.  And Forever on the Internet.

                                [*] [*] [*]

     Hard To Say I'm Sorry Department: While I've never gotten a flood of
mail on _The Lamp!_, I do get the occasional trickle.  However, at some
point, Delphi discontinued forwarding of its email from Web based accounts
to other email accounts and one piece of email in particular from Jeff
Blakeney, Dean of the Apple II University on Delphi, announcing a new
course that deserved coverage here in _The Lamp!_ lay dormant in the abyss.
I found the mail only after sending a POP3 mail client out after my lost
thelamp@delphi.com email after chatting with Just Dave Miller on Delphi for
a bit.  My apologies to Jeff and to those of you who read _The Lamp!_ each
month.  The gist of the letter containing the announcement is in one of
Jeff's forum posts printed this month.


Ryan
thelamp@delphi.com

ASCII ART BEGINS
_________  _                     _                                      _
|__   __| | |                   | |                                    | |
   | |    | |                   | |                                    | |
   | |    | |___     ____       | |       _____   __ ___ _   _ _____   | |
   | |    | ___ \   / __ \      | |      /____ \  | v   v | | v ___ \  | |
   | |    | |  | | | /__\ \     | |       ____| | | /\ /\ | |  /   \ \ | |
   | |    | |  | | | _____|     | |      / ___  | | || || | | |    | | |_|
   | |    | |  | | | |_____     | |____  | |__| | | || || | |  \___/ /  _
   |_|    |_|  |_| \______|     |______| \____^_| |_||_||_| | |\____/  |_|
                                                            | |
                                                            | |
                                                            |_|

ASCII ART ENDS


[EOA]
[OPN]------------------------------
     A FUNNY THING HAPPENED. . . . |
-----------------------------------
Checking out A2 on Delphi
"""""""""""""""""""""""""
by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W.
                    [thelamp@delphi.com]

       * The Heat Is On

              * Miscellanea

                     * Rumor Mill

                            * Public Postings

                                        * Best Of The Best

                              THE HEAT IS ON
                              """"""""""""""

     [*] Telecommunications         ....... Finally--PPP
     [*] User Groups & Publications ....... Wanted: A Bug Free NiftySpell
     [*] Productivity Software      ....... The New Appleworks
     [*] Hardware Hacker            ....... IDE?  SCSI?  Apple II?
     [*] Productivity Software      ....... !Help! I Need Somebody

                                MISCELLANEA
                                """""""""""

MAXIMUM SERIAL PORT SPEEDS ON THE //C+   The issue is not the serial port
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   chips themselves, it is simply
that there aren't the proper pins on the serial port connector to do a
proper hardware handshake, and XON/XOFF is not sufficient at speeds higher
than 9600 in the vast majority of cases.

That said, I have had the //c+ working at 19200, but not reliably and
repeatedly.

-
 Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W., L.S.W.  --  rsuenaga@apple2.org
 Editor and Publisher, _The Lamp!_, published monthly on Delphi
 Posted by PTMM v2.5 - The integrated information solution
                       (RSUENAGA, 16342, GO COM A2)


SQUEEZING OUT FRESH JUICED   The September issue of Juiced.GS (V3I3) went
""""""""""""""""""""""""""   to the printer on Wednesday morning, and
they're hoping to have it back in my hands by Friday evening, Monday
morning at the latest.

If all goes well, I may get some of the issues out in Saturday's mail, the
rest in Monday's mail.

At any rate, it won't be long now!

FYI, this is a 24-page issue with lots of goodies, including reviews of the
newest IIGS software and a complete report (with photos!) from Kfest '98.


 Max Jones, Juiced.GS
 http://www.wbwip.com/juiced.gs
 Delivered by Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5
                       (JUICEDGS, 16159, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   GreetinGS!
"""""
The September issue of Juiced.GS is printed and ready for final processing.
It would be going out in Tuesday's mail, but I got very busy at work today
and the print shop had just closed when I arrived to pick up the magazines.
DARNIT!!!

Never fear, I will pick them early tomorrow. Bar famine, plague, natural
disaster, or another Ken Starr report, they will be in the mail early
Wednesday morning.

Sorry for the slight delay. Your issues should begin arriving late this
week.


 Max Jones, Juiced.GS
 http://www.wbwip.com/juiced.gs
 Delivered by Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5
                       (JUICEDGS, 16257, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   The September issue of Juiced.GS went out in Wednesday's mail.
"""""
My guess is that it will begin arriving in U.S. mail boxes on Friday, and
in foreign locations by the middle of next week.

Hope you all enjoy the issue!

I will be along in a few days with a complete index of the issue, provided
mainly so those who don't subscribe can see what they're missing. :-)


 Max Jones, Juiced.GS
 http://www.wbwip.com/juiced.gs
 Delivered by Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5
                       (JUICEDGS, 16327, GO COM A2)


KFEST '99 LOGO FROM ENGLAND   Thanks to Ewen Wannop, the new logo is done!!
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""
You can see it at the official KFest webpage -

        http://www.kfest.org


The Big Cheese

 Cindy Adams -- cindyadams@delphi.com

 http://www.kfest.org
                      (CINDYADAMS, 15844, GO COM A2)


IIGS SYSTEM SOFTWARE FROM APPLE FTP VIA THE MAC   It is not 100% clear to
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   me, but I'm guessing
you're asking if there's any way to download the Apple IIgs system software
with your Macintosh and have it be converted into Apple IIgs usable disks.

If this is indeed what you're asking, the answer is yes.

There are several ways to go about doing this, but the simplest way would
be to get disk copy images of the IIgs system software and use Disk Copy or
ShrinkWrap or an equivalent on your Mac to convert them into usable Apple
IIgs ProDOS 800k disks.

If you access the files at:

ftp://ftp.apple.com/Apple_Support_Area/Apple.Software.Updates/US/Apple_II
    /Apple_IIGS_System_6.0.1

(all on one line) the disks with the .sea.bin suffixes are the ones in
DiskCopy format.

 -
 Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W., L.S.W. - rsuenaga@apple2.org
 Editor and Publisher, _The Lamp!_, published monthly on Delphi
 "Teaching the Apple II user how to fish since 1982"
 Posted by PTMM v2.5 - The integrated information solution
                       (RSUENAGA, 16477, GO COM A2)


SMALL HARD DRIVES ARE BIG ENOUGH FOR THE IIGS   There are no disk repair
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   utilities for HFS volumes
that will work on the GS.

So, while you can set up a huge HFS partition on the GS, and use it, when
something goes wrong with the data on the disk (and something WILL, trust
me on that), you have no way of repairing it.

And, really, for most people, 20-50 megs is entirely adequate for an Apple
II.


Gary R. Utter
                         (UTTER, 15708, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   A combination of what Gary said (no HFS repair utilities, adequate
"""""   space with small hard drives) and the fact that the Focus is
extraordinarily easy to deal with (just pop it in a slot, no cables,
termination, IDs, just go).

-
Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W., L.S.W. - rsuenaga@apple2.org
Editor and Publisher, _The Lamp!_, published monthly on Delphi
Delivered via FFNSS alpha .6
                       (RSUENAGA, 15725, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Because for most people that's all they need.
"""""
GS/OS stopped growing, it's not a drive hog. :)

With the ProDOS limit being 32MB per partition, and not everyone wanting to
have their screen filled with partitions like the one IIgs I drag around
with me, a 200MB drive is most anyone really needs for just your average
computer usage. HFS is not the answer. When, not if, When it crashes,
unless you have a Mac handy you can't fix it. ..and even if there is a Mac
handy chances are the drive will not have the Mac driver installed so it
wont be mountable for the average user to run Disk First Aid and fix it. If
you have the drive on a RAMFast, forget it. The Mac driver will have been
eaten already. If you set the drive up with Chinook SCSI, there is no
driver and probably no space to add one. If you used Advanced Disk Util, it
wasn't installed but space exists, but most other Mac SCSI utils will not
install the driver due to 'lack of space'.

So, for all but seasoned users, HFS is out of the question in my opinion,
it will go corrupt, patch or no patch, Mac or IIgs formatted/initialized...

Tony
                        (T_DIAZ, 15784, GO COM A2)


PROS AND CONS OF .PDF DOCUMENTATION   PDF is cool, and it certainly has its
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   uses, but for standard text documents
it's a complete waste of disk space and bandwidth. I see no point in taking
a perfectly good 300K text manual and converting it into a multiple
megabyte "portable" format just to preserve some pretty formatting. And how
difficult would it be to make a plain text version available right next to
the pdf version?

The cost of printing may have gone up in recent years, but by switching to
electronic documentation the software and hardware manufacturers certainly
haven't reduced their prices. In fact, the cost has gone way up when you
consider that you have to use your own paper (tons of it) if you really
want a hardcopy of their manuals.

I applaud USR (3Com) for including printed installation and basic usage
manuals, but then that's one of the reasons you pay extra for their modems.
However, I vote thumbs down on their discontinuation of plan text
electronic manuals. I spent a good 20 minutes on their toll-free support
number (a benefit of paying for the Courier, BTW) and finally arranged to
have a text manual sent to me.

 -----------------------------------------------------
 Tony Ward, A2 Database Manager
 [Delivered with Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5]
 --
 To be intoxicated is to feel sophisticated but not be able to say it.
                        (TONYW1, 15875, GO COM A2)


30 WAYS ULTRAMACROS 4 IS BETTER THAN ULTRAMACROS 3   According to the July,
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   1992 issue of The
AppleWorks Forum, UltraMacros 4 added 30 new commands to UltraMacros.
According to the article, UM 4.x requires (at least) an Enhanced IIe with
256k of RAM.

Joe Kohn
                       (JOE_KOHN, 15966, GO COM A2)


WEBWORKS GS AND HIERARCHIC   WebWorks GS may work with the 1.6.1 version of
""""""""""""""""""""""""""   Hierarchic; however, I've been advised by
those in the know that I can't guarantee this, so you should be sure to
upgrade to the CDev version.

Sorry for this mixup -- I've corrected the WebWorks GS master disk I keep
so this won't happen again.

Joe will be sending replacement disks to everyone that got an incorrect
WebWorks GS disk.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                        (SHEPPY, 16306, GO COM A2)


GSHISEN ANONYMOUS   Well, sooner or later, I suppose, it just had to
"""""""""""""""""   happen...

I'd like to call this meeting to order, and introduce to you the newest
member of our online self-help group...

"Hello. My name is Joe and I'm an addict."

"One day, not that long ago, life looked like easy street, but there were
dangers at my door. I was innocent and quite naive, yet I trembled as I
pressed the download button. Little did I realize at the time, but clicking
that button changed my life. Ever since, I've been unable to eat or sleep,
and all I can think about is getting my next fix. I need help. I am an
addict. I cannot control my desire to play GShisen."

"Please help me to understand my addiction. You can do that by downloading
Kelvin Sherlock's GShisen, and then you can share with me how you were able
to avoid addiction. Please do that at once, as my addiction is getting
worse by the minute. I need help. I am an addict. GShisen - it's my wife
and it's my life."

Welcome to GShisen Anonymous, Joe. You've taken a very positive step by
admitting your addiction, and you are commended for being the first to
admit your addiction to GShisen; you've paved the way for many others who
suffer from GShisen addiction. With help Joe, you and others can break the
horrible cycle of addiction to GShisen.

If you, or someone you love, suffers from the same symptoms as poor Joe,
you too can get help. Just pick up your phone and dial 1-800-GShisen;
sympathetic operators are standing by.
                       (JOE_KOHN, 16437, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   folks
"""""
there is an evil man among us

Kelvin Sherlock has produced what he jokingly calls a game (GShisen)

Be warned ... this is not a game ... this thing takes over your life

Excuse me while I go and play another few dozen games

Well done Kelvin!!!!

Kevin Noonan
                       (GSWOMBAT, 16484, GO COM A2)


PRINTING TO A LASERWRITER VIA APPLEWORKS   Easiest thing in the world! I'm
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   assuming that you have a IIgs,
since the WorkStation (AppleTalk) cards for a IIe are sort of rare. I'm
also assuming that you're using a PostScript laser printer, for similar
reasons. Now, in AppleWorks, set up a custom printer called "Laser" or
whatever. It should be just like an ImageWriter printer, but should print
to the slot that is turned on for AppleTalk. That's slot 7 in a ROM 01,
probably slot 1 in a ROM 3. Now quit back to the Finder and get the Net
Printer Control Panel (Select Apple menu, Control Panels, Net Printer...).
Click on the button for uploading the ImageWriter Emulator to the printer.
This convinces the LaserWriter, for as long as you don't turn it off, that
it is actually an ImageWriter. Now you can print from AppleWorks as normal,
just using the "Laser" custom printer. The proportional fonts "P1" and "P2"
will print in the Times font. I hope that this answers your question.
                        (GARETH, 15776, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   It's been a _long_ time, so I may be fuzzy on these details.
"""""
To print from AppleWorks to a LaserWriter Plus with a //c+, I'd suggest
using either Diablo Emulation mode, or using Imagewriter Emulation mode.

I _think_ Diablo Emulation mode can be selected by a DIP switch or front
panel control on the printer. Otherwise, it is _probably_ selected by the
following software command:

              statusdict begin x setsoftwareiomode

where x = an integer between 1 and 5. I don't have the info handy.

To use Imagewriter Emulation mode, the text file 'IWEM' (found on GS/OS
system disks) must be sent to the printer. On a IIGS or //e with
workstation card, this is usually handled as part of the Appletalk
initialization process. Then, before every print job, the Appletalk
firmware prepends the command '_WBJ_' to invoke the emulator.

On a //c+, you would do this manually, by sending the IWEM file to the
printer and prepending the _WBJ_ to the print job. Alternatively, it seems
I once added the '_WBJ_' command to the end of the IWEM file and also set
an infinite job timeout on the printer so that I never had to worry about
sending the '_WBJ_' command again.

In summary, I'd recommend option #1 as it is simpler. But, if Imagewriter
emulation is important, I'll put on my thinking cap and give you exact
instructions on how to send the IWEM file manually with the mods I
mentioned. It may just take me a week or so to get to it.

BTW, AppleWorks 5.1 works well for sending the PostScript text files and
commands to the LaserWriter. You just need to set up a special custom
printer that sends harmless CTRL-J's at the beginning of each line instead
of the normal LPI and CPI control commands.

Alternatively, a fine program called ProTerm 3.x does a great job of
interfacing with a PostScript printer. You may have heard of it. <g> <g>

Hugh...
                       (HUGHHOOD, 16377, GO COM A2)


EXTENDED KEYBOARD LIGHT SUPPORT ON THE IIGS   The lights on an extended
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   keyboard (any brand) won't
work on the IIgs unless you install a system extra to activate them. The
exception is the ROM 3 IIgs, which I think automatically supports the caps
lock light. I use a tiny (and very interrupt friendly) init called Lights
from an old issue of 8/16 Central which lets me assign various functions to
the lights. A similar, and much more recent, option is Sheppy's
KeyNotifier.

To activate the extended keys, I use Bill Tudor's Keyboard Extender.

 -----------------------------------------------------
 Tony Ward, A2 Database Manager
 [Delivered with Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5]
 --
 Is virus a 'micro' organism?
                        (TONYW1, 15880, GO COM A2)


ANOTHER TRIP TO 6502 MEMORY LANE   Not only did I use a tape drive for the
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   first few months that I owned my Apple
II, I also bought my first TV to serve as a monitor.

The first assembler I ever used on an Apple II was tape based, too--and the
editor was on a different tape from the assembler. A typical session was:

1. Load the editor.

2. Enter a program.

3. Load the assembler.

4. Assemble the program.

5. Run the program. (crash)

6. Go to step 1.

I never had much sympathy when people complained about the speed of a
development system after that. :)

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 16039, GO COM A2)


IDE VS. SCSI, APPLE II STYLE   IDE = Integrated Drive Electronics.
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   Virtually everything needed to connect this
type of drive to an Intel-compatible type computer is included in the drive
itself, and due to market forces, it is usually available cheap.  However,
don't think that means you can't use it on other computers.  For instance,
many recent Macs use IDE drives, and a lot of Apple II hard drive setups
were IDE based, including the Vulcan, Innerdrive, Focus, Turbo IDE, and
Microdrive setups.

SCSI = Small Computer Systems Interface.  This is what we've been using on
Apple II's and Macs for years.

You can get a pretty decent primer on IDE and its successors at:

http://www.netmeg.net/faq/computers/hardware/pc/enhanced-ide

If you want a pretty decent primer on SCSI, you can check:

http://www.cis.ohio-state.edu/hypertext/faq/usenet/scsi-faq/top.html

With the appropriate controller (such as //SHH Systeme's TurboIDE,
Microdrive, or Microdrive Turbo), you certainly can use an IDE drive on an
Apple II.

 -
 Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W., L.S.W. - rsuenaga@apple2.org
 Editor and Publisher, _The Lamp!_, published monthly on Delphi
 "Teaching the Apple II user how to fish since 1982"
 Posted by PTMM v2.5 - The integrated information solution
                       (RSUENAGA, 15851, GO COM A2)


CD ROM FORMATS AND THE APPLE II   Most commonly with an Apple II, the CD
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   Roms you encounter will have partitions
formatted as either High Sierra (ISO 9660 compatible, supposedly), HFS, or
ProDOS.

It's possible to have CD Roms formatted as other operating systems too, but
that's less common.

 -
 Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W., L.S.W. - rsuenaga@apple2.org
 Editor and Publisher, _The Lamp!_, published monthly on Delphi
 "Teaching the Apple II user how to fish since 1982"
 Posted by PTMM v2.5 - The integrated information solution
                       (RSUENAGA, 16213, GO COM A2)


AND WHO SAID APPLE II'S AREN'T MADE ANYMORE?   Aw, come on, Ryan. The
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   1400cs _is_ an Apple II. It
just runs that "other" O/S, too. ;)

In fact, I developed a lot of GSoft BASIC on my 1400cs. (The rest was
developed on my other Apple II, my M*Power 200 MHz 604e tower computer.)

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 16038, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Okay, okay. . . I admit it.  The Apple II I use the most nowadays
"""""   is my 1400cs as well.  However, every week I use every single Apple
II I have set up here, particularly my //c+, which I think might be the
coolest //c+ in captivity (1 meg memory, 40 meg hard drive, LCD screen, //c
ET monitor, //c Color Composite monitor, mouse, modem, clock :) except for
those weeks I forget about my other portable Apple II, the Duo 2300c ;-)

In fact, this message is going to be delivered by the very Apple II 1400cs
I mentioned above and ProTERM 3 via the in development Fat Free Non Stick
Spray scripts.

-
Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W., L.S.W. - rsuenaga@apple2.org
Editor and Publisher, _The Lamp!_, published monthly on Delphi
Delivered via FFNSS alpha .77 -- beta coming soon
                       (RSUENAGA, 16061, GO COM A2)


DO YOU REMEMBER. . . CV TECH?   I was out scrounging in one of my favorite
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   part dumps today and came across a CV Tech
GS RAM card. It appears to be equipped with 1MB DRAMs, only the top row is
filled -- so it's a 2 meg board, expandable to 4...(right?) and there is
also an extra slot next to the card.

The CV Tech stuff came out long after I first left the Apple // scene, so I
am ignorant of card's configuration and expansion capabilities. Any help
would be appreciated, thanks in advance.

1.) Specifically which DRAMs are required to finish the board?

2.) What goes into the extra slot?

3.) Are there docs and util software available anywhere online (legally)?
                        (SFAHEY, 16042, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   RE: CV Tech GS Memory Board
"""""
 >  1.) Specifically which DRAMs are required to finish the board?

The chips are 1Mb by 1 DRAM memory chips.  You must use 120ns rated or
faster chips.

 >  2.) What goes into the extra slot?

Any other GS memory board up to 4Mb in capacity, that will fit between the
CV Tech card and the GS case (this can be a tight fit).  You'll have to
make sure that there is some sort of insulated spacer between the
piggy-back board and the GS case, and maybe between the two boards, if one
is twisted enough that the wire leads from the CV Tech board hit the chip
leads on the ICs of the add-on board. The docs indicate that any
piggy-backed cards must be fully populated, although the CV Tech card does
not have to be fully populated in this configuration.

 >  3.) Are there docs and util software available anywhere online
 >  (legally)?

There was no software provided with the card.  The documentation I got was
4 printed pages; only two of which were meaningful for usage.  The other
two were the title page and warranty information.

One thing you need to establish is whether this is a Rev A or Rev B board.
I have a Rev B board.  Someone else will have to give you information on
the Rev A board.  The Rev B board has jumpers that are used to configure
the card for the amount of memory installed on the card, as follows:


    1Mb       2Mb       3Mb       4Mb
   -----     -----     -----     -----
   A B C     A B C     A B C     A B C
2  O=O O     O=O O     O O=O     O O=O
1  O=O O     O O=O     O=O O     O O=O



 - Don (IronTooth)

Delivered by my ANSITerm off-line reader scripts...

                         They're OLRight!
                       (DZAHNISER, 16047, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   This was/is a known problem, and there is a fix. It requires a
"""""   specific ROM chip that CV Tech supplied. I had a fully populated
Rev A card with a fully populated Apple 1meg card in the piggy back
connector, for a total of 5 megs that was recognized on my ROM 01 GS. But,
it required the special ROM chip.

I doubt that Sequential carries that chip, but you could give them a try. I
updated the card to a Rev B, so I no longer have the chip.


Jeff Carr

Cruising the 'rainbow' path provided by:
Spectrum v2.1 and Crock O' Gold v2.5
                       (LUMITECH, 16095, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   I've been looking for RAM for my CV Tech GS memory board and
"""""   compiled a (short) list of compatible DRAMs. I thought I'd share it
with everyone -- and if anyone is doing a FAQ, feel free to use the list.

I got lucky, the board is a revision "B". Thanks everyone!

Toshiba TC511000P-85 1Mx1 page mode DRAM
Toshiba TC511000P-10 1Mx1 page mode DRAM
Samsung KM41C1000P-10 1Mx1 page mode DRAM
Samsung KM41C1000P-80 1Mx1 page mode DRAM
Mitsubishi M5M4100AP 1Mx1 page mode DRAM
Motorola MCM511000P-10 1Mx1 page mode DRAM
Motorola MCM511000P-85 1Mx1 page mode DRAM
Siemens HYB511000-85 1Mx1 page mode DRAM
Siemens HYB511000-70 1Mx1 page mode DRAM
Intel P21010-08 1Mx1 page mode DRAM
Intel P21010-10 1Mx1 page mode DRAM
                        (SFAHEY, 16150, GO COM A2)


SECOND SIGHT SOFTWARE   Seriously, I'll let Michael expand further on
"""""""""""""""""""""   Facelift but for the most part these are the
programs which are SS specific or aware:

Graphic/Animation viewers:
==========================
jpeGS
SecondView (comes with card)
SecondView Pro (commercial -- ?still available?)
GView (shareware)
Thirdview
FlicGS (view FLI animation files)
viewDL (view DL animations)
A SS specific fractal generating program.

Reference:
==========
DiscQuest (CD-ROM reference 'engine' which is SS aware)
DiscQuest Encyclopedia (A 1995 CD-ROM encyclopedia 'engine' which is SS
aware. I think the encyclopedia CD-ROM is Compton's for the MAC or PC)

Games:
======
Falfus
Cogito Returns (a SS specific mod of the original)
Omega-GS (Text screen based game employing SS text screen)

Miscellaneous:
==============
CDA which gives SS screen proper IIgs border color.
Facelift (Universal IIgs video API. Currently handles IIgs and SS video).
SSRomFix (System INIT which fixes a bug in SS ROM)

This is off the top of my head. I'm sure there are other programs out there
that I don't recall at the moment.

> Does the toolbox patches you mention let existing software run
> accelerated on the SSII card?

Again, Michael can best answer this. But, the short answer is no. The
patches are intended to allow greater resolution for IIgs Desktop based
programs (if my memory serves me here...)

Paul.

Paul Schultz
schultp@delphi.com
sent your way via Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5
                        (SCHULTP, 16382, GO COM A2)

>>>>> > Does the toolbox patches you mention let existing software
""""" > run accelerated on the SSII card?

Not as such. There might be some speed improvement due to the memory layout
of the VGA modes used (8-bit pixels instead of 2- or 4-bit in SHR modes),
and some rectangular scrolling operations that are done completely on the
card are quite fast. But I decided to patch in at a fairly low level,
hoping to reduce the amount of work involved (it turned out to be the
reverse, of course), so most of the higher-level drawing code is still the
same. This choice also avoided the problem of having to come up with my own
region manipulation code, as Apple has a patent on their's.

> In 1988 I designed an accelerated graphics card for the GS
> using a TI 34010 chip, only I did not finish the project since
> I was focused on graduating from college.

Oh, that's a shame that the card never got finished. I would have loved
one. I originally came up with the design for Facelift well before the SS
was even rumoured, and at that point I was looking at that very chip as a
good candidate. This was several years after you, though (1992-3). I was
quite disappointed when Sequential ended up choosing a lame SVGA chip for
their card.

> The difficulty as I remember it is that if even if you
> shadow all screen writes to the new card any program directly
> reading back the screen data would read the old screen memory
> which would not be updated.

Right, there's just no way around it. Full compatibility isn't possible if
you also want to extend the system, and try to move work off to the card.
My plan was to only support programs that went strictly through the
toolbox, and shut off the patches for incompatible programs. By allowing
programs direct access to the screen memory, even in a prescribed way,
Apple made it very difficult to extend the system. In many ways, it seems
that Apple intentionally crippled the system, perhaps to avoid competition
with the Mac.

-- Michael
                          (SAR, 16489, GO COM A2)


FACELIFT DEVELOPMENT KIT STATUS   Yes, the latest released version of the
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   development kit (v0.6b1) is available at:

<ftp://trenco.myrias.com/users/mhackett/FaceliftDev06b1.bny>

(Replace .bny with .bsq for a BinSCII version, if you prefer.)

Note that this is for programmers only -- there are no demos or anything.
The archive includes all the docs, the library itself, and headers for
ORCA/M and C. It does not include the actual CDEV that you will need to run
your programs, however. If, after reading the docs, and starting to play
with the library, you need the CDEV to continue with your work, just drop
me an email and I'll set you up with what you need.

BTW, just to be clear, the QuickDraw/Toolbox patches are not available in
any way, shape, or form at this time.

-- Michael
                          (SAR, 16492, GO COM A2)


SECOND SIGHT SPECTRUM DISPLAY BUG?   Ewen, or maybe I'd better say Richard
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   since I think he wrote the SS-aware
ANSI display driver for Spectrum :-)

I just ran across a bug with the SecondSight ANSI display with Spectrum
2.1. I actually encountered this about a year back and e-mailed SHS but
since I became re-acquainted with this bug I thought I'd relay it here as
well.

The bug occurs while in the Spectrum ANSI display and you disconnect from
your ISP (I use the ISP's signal for disconnect...CTRL-D from their main
HOST: prompt). Anyway, you are left in the ANSI display. Now here's the
bug: If you use OA-D to try to bring up the Connect Dialog box, you are
left staring at the ANSI display. On investigation, (i.e. hooking up a IIgs
monitor to the built-in video port) what is happening is Spectrum's Connect
Dialog comes up on the SHR Desktop display on the built-in video but the
ANSI display doesn't switch out of the VGA text mode. So, if you only have
a SS/VGA monitor set-up, it appears as if your computer has locked up. In
reality, hitting OA-. will cancel the Connect Dialog albeit 'behind the
scenes'! Once the Connect dialog has 'relinquished keyboard I/O', you can
use the OA-W sequence to return to the SHR desktop display.

Admittedly, this is a small bug. I wouldn't be surprised if I'm the only
person to encounter it since you need a specific set-up and a specific set
of circumstances to trigger the bug.

For me, I know what to avoid. But, I thought I'd report it anyway.

Paul.

Paul Schultz
schultp@delphi.com
sent your way via Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5
                        (SCHULTP, 16442, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   This didn't happen to me when I tried it, it closed the display and
"""""   showed the dialog just fine. Make sure that you have the IIgs
monitor set to follow the ANSI display in the 'More settings' options for
ANSI. If it is set to follow the desktop, then you must have a second
monitor connected to the video output.

 Ewen Wannop - Speccie - Wed 30 Sep 1998 - 294 days till KFest
 Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5!
 Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120
 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/
                        (EWANNOP, 16468, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I went to the 'More settings' and kept the SecondSight at: ANSI
"""""   while I changed the IIgs Monitor to: ANSI also. This allows me to
use the OA-D from within the ANSI display and returns me to the Spectrum
desktop and the Dial/Connect dialog. In fact, other combinations of these
two settings OTHER THAN THE DEFAULT SETTINGS will allow the OA-D to return
to the Spectrum desktop from the ANSI display. However, I still can't get
it to return if I have the SS set to: ANSI and the IIgs Monitor set to:
Spectrum desktop (the defaults).

Paul.

Paul Schultz
schultp@delphi.com
sent your way via Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5
                        (SCHULTP, 16480, GO COM A2)



                                RUMOR MILL
                                """"""""""

APPLE2.ORG EXPANDS   Just a short announcement, with all this discussion on
""""""""""""""""""   who uses what type of card and where/when. I have
added another piece to the collection at http://www.apple2.org.

     The Apple II Information Resource, look for it on the link list on the
left column.

What cards use what RAM, what drives work with what computer, all this and
lots more information is available.

Tony
                        (T_DIAZ, 15929, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   Anyone that wants to contribute any images, although at this time
"""""   it will be a little hard to acknowledge contributions, I will keep
a list. I am planning to redo most of those images in the next few months,
as I put the hardware into categorized/numbered boxes. Most of it is boxed
up now but just not listed which means if I want something I have to go
through about 25 boxes, at least. JPEG is preferred over GIF, so if anyone
is making anything new use JPEG if you can.

I would be nice if there was a reasonable JPEG viewer for the Apple II,
even if it applied the Second Sight theory and made you scroll. I was not
too impressed with the JPEG functions in Superconvert 4. But then again,
looking at some of what I was throwing at it...

Tony
                        (T_DIAZ, 15968, GO COM A2)


AND BYTE WORKS DOES TOO   There are some new technical descriptions and a
"""""""""""""""""""""""   special offer for the month of September on the
Byte Works web site. Stop by and check them out at
www.hypermall.com/byteworks.

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 15957, GO COM A2)


SHEPPY ON Y2K   The so-called Year 2000 problem is about 20% fact, 30%
'""""""""""""   legitimate concern, and 50% overactive imagination.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                        (SHEPPY, 16020, GO COM A2)


MARINETTI'S HERE NOW, WHEN'S SPECTRUM 2.2 COMING   The wizard of Oz does it
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   again...

Richard has done a magnificent job with it, and you will be able to Telnet
all over the place using the supplied Telnet application...

You should start to see from now on the release of a number of applications
that will support Marinetti 2.0.

But to put Spectrum users in the picture, the new Marinetti 2.0 does not
work with the TopCat XCMD that was released last year for Marinetti 1.0. I
have no plans to write an update to TopCat, as the new Spectrum 2.2 should
be available some time soon. Spectrum 2.2 will allow you to choose whether
you want a serial or TCP/IP environment, and with TCP/IP, you will be able
to open multiple Telnet sessions at once.

 Ewen Wannop - Speccie - Tue 29 Sep 1998 7:53:19 am
 Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5!
 Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120
 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/
                        (EWANNOP, 16430, GO COM A2)


THE NEW CLARISWO. . . UH, APPLEWORKS?   Finally, some respect from Apple!
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   They've just put up a web page for
AppleWorks 5: <http://www.apple.com/appleworks> :-)

Now, can anyone who has used the new version tell me what it says under
import options now for original AppleWorks files? Who's bright idea (to
rename CW to AW) was this anyway? In addition to the confusion caused,
surely they're going to lose a lot of Windows customers who won't want to
buy a product with an Apple logo on it, even if it is the same product as
they used before.

-- Michael
                          (SAR, 16245, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Apple always owned Claris, and as ClarisWorks has been dragged back
"""""   into the fold, and probably nobody at Apple now knows what an Apple
II is, or that there is already a product already called AppleWorks, they
decide to rename ClarisWorks.

If they have not changed anything since the last ClarisWorks I looked at,
it imports classic AppleWorks files just fine. Something they made sure of
in all its incarnations, as they were always trying to woo Apple II
education users over to the Macintosh!

Someone out there with an iMac can let us know the definitive answer, if
they can find the invisible floppy disk drive that comes with that machine.

 Ewen Wannop - Speccie
 Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5!
 Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120
 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/
                        (EWANNOP, 16271, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I'm pretty sure they still know very well there was a former
"""""   AppleWorks, at least when they consulted there lawyers about the
title copyright. It's only, they do not care anymore anything about the
original AppleWorks and they're obviously sure the flood of iMacs (as
projected and obviously realized number of sales) shipped with AppleWorks
will drown the limited number of left original AW users. Sad, but true...

Me too, I'm curious, how they resolved the naming problem and generally the
import of AW (classic) files. May be using AppleWorks 3 as name? There's
foreseeable, somewhere in a not so distant future, some skilled iMac user,
wondering about the strange file format of the ancestor of his actual
program . . .:))

Best regards, Ulrich

[ Delivered by ProTERM Message Manager (PTMM) v2.5.1 ]
                       (UHAUSMANN, 16274, GO COM A2)



                              PUBLIC POSTINGS
                              """""""""""""""

SHEPPY RECLASSIFIES SOME SHAREWARE PRODUCTS   Due to falling demand and
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   even more sharply falling
willingness to pay for software on the part of the Apple II community, the
following products are being reclassified as freeware effective Monday,
August 7, 1998:

KeyNotifier
SmartRestart
ProBOOT 8 (NOT ProBOOT for the Apple IIgs)
Tsukue
Wolfenstein 3D Scenario Converter

The Apple IIgs version of ProBOOT is still shareware. If you'd like to
register a copy, send a check for $15 -- made payable to Eric Shepherd --
to Joe Kohn at Shareware Solutions II; he's kindly offered to forward
checks to me. DO NOT make the checks out to Joe; checks for ProBOOT made
out to Joe will just get deposited into the nearest wormhole, and that's
bad for your finances.

Please note that this means that my three non-freeware products remaining:
ProBOOT, Shifty List, and WebWorks GS are all available only from Shareware
Solutions II. If you get it somewhere else, something's fishy. :)

If you feel like making a special contribution to the SheppyWare general
fund, send a check to Joe, payable to me. :)

And I also ask anyone that uses any of the newly-freeware products to be
sure to subscribe to, or renew their subscription to, Shareware Solutions
II and Juiced.GS as a sign of support for the Apple II community.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                        (SHEPPY, 15792, GO COM A2)


A TRIO OF UPDATED SHEPPYWARE PRODUCTS   After a long delay, ProBOOT for the
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   Apple IIgs has been updated to
version 5.3! The new version fixes a couple of minor bugs, corrects several
documentation errors, and removes some unnecessary data that was bloating
the code.

You can download the new version at ftp://ftp.sheppyware.net/pub/apple_iigs
/ProBOOT53.shk.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                        (SHEPPY, 16049, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   LotsaTools has been updated to version 1.1.1. The new version is a
"""""   little smaller, has an rVersion resource, and has updated
documentation.

You can download the new version at ftp://ftp.sheppyware.net/pub/apple_iigs
/Lotsa111.shk.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                        (SHEPPY, 16052, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   Cleaner Clean Up 1.0.6 has been released. This update is a bit
"""""   smaller, and has updated documentation.

You can download Cleaner Clean Up 1.0.6 at
ftp://ftp.sheppyware.net/pub/apple_iigs/CleanUp106.shk.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                        (SHEPPY, 16054, GO COM A2)


SHEPPYWARE ONLINE REGISTRATION WITH KAGI   My online registration page is
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   now available: you can now
purchase SheppyWare shareware and commercial products on the Web by credit
card. Visit <http://order.kagi.com/?QGC> and have at it.

If your web browser supports it, you can use a secure form to submit your
order; otherwise, you can submit the order insecurely.

At the moment, only Shifty List can be registered online. I'll be adding
WebWorks GS and ProBOOT tonight or tomorrow.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                        (SHEPPY, 16397, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   Wow, that was easy. My online ordering page now includes ProBOOT
"""""   and WebWorks GS. So if you've been holding back on registering or
buying SheppyWare because you hate writing checks, now's the time! :)

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                        (SHEPPY, 16398, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   Which brings up a new point: Sarah and I have looked over our
"""""   financial situation, and we've decided that I need to start
bringing in more shareware money to help accelerate our process of climbing
out of our rather substantial debt. As such, I'm scaling down my Apple II
development somewhat, and will be doing more Mac and BeOS development from
here on out.

There will be more Apple II software coming from me, but at a slower pace,
as it doesn't make financial sense for me to keep spewing out software that
only sells two or three dozen copies at best.

At this point, you should expect one more Apple IIgs release from me this
year. My next release for the IIgs after that won't be until early 1999.

I will probably continue updating some of my older apps for contact info,
as I've been doing the last few weeks, but that takes very little of my
time.

If you're a Mac user, keep your eyes out for my first Mac shareware
product, which probably will be out in the next two weeks or so.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                        (SHEPPY, 16190, GO COM A2)


JUICED.GS VOLUME 3 ISSUE 3   Announcing ...
""""""""""""""""""""""""""

=====  Juiced.GS, Volume 3, Issue 3  =====


The September 1998 edition of Juiced.GS, the Apple II world's premier
IIGS-specific magazine, is now arriving in subscriber mail boxes.

This issue is being mailed to 262 subscribers in 44 states and numerous
points around the globe.

Here's what you'll find in this issue:

============


FEATURES

Cover Story:  Kfest '98 ... Avila College in Kansas City, Missouri, was
home base for a flurry of announcements for new and upgraded IIGS software
products. This is a firsthand report of those exciting days!

In addition to official activities, read about goings-on behind the scenes
-- and in the dorm rooms -- during our report on "Kfest After Hours".

NOTE: Exclusive photographs from Kfest '98 are also included in this issue.


REVIEWS

Juiced.GS is the first publication to offer in-depth reviews of the latest
IIGS software releases!

GSoft BASIC:  Eric Shepherd gives IIGS users an up-close-and-personal look
at the latest IIGS-specific programming language from the Byte Works.

NiftySpell:  The first and only universal spell-checker is put through the
paces. Find out about this cool new product, and see the first screen shots
to be published.

WebWorks GS:  Find out what you need to know about the first IIGS-specific
HTML editing software for Web page authors in this review, complete with a
screen shot.


COLUMNS

Telecommunications:  Searching for an ISP ... Tony Ward gives readers a
primer on shopping for an Internet Service Provider.

My Home Page:  Quite a show on Kfest stage ... A few personal thoughts from
our editor on the recent Kfest, and other newsy notes from Juiced.GS.

II Be Named Later:  Our columnist, Ryan Suenaga, shares his feelings on the
most important Apple II event of the year.


DEPARTMENTS

Shareware Spotlight:  Fontpimp, a new utility that converts Windows/PC
TrueType fonts into IIGS font format for use with Pointless is in the
Spotlight this issue, as is LILAN, a cool new Finder Extra. Another
Juiced.GS shareware collection is also unveiled.

DumplinGS:  Lots of news from around the Apple II world, including an
updated list of important Web sites that should be in every Apple II user's
favorites list.

Letters from the Land of Rom ... Juiced.GS readers ask questions, get
answers, and tell us what's on their minds.

============

Juiced.GS is a quarterly, printed publication available by subscription
only.

A subscription for 1998 is $14 in the U.S., Canada or Mexico, $20
elsewhere. To subscribe, send a check or money order in U.S. funds to:

 Max Jones
 Juiced.GS
 2217 Lakeview Drive
 Sullivan, IN  47882

Makes checks or money orders payable to Max Jones. Sorry, no credit cards
or purchase orders can be accepted.

Complete sets of 1996 and 1997 issues are available for $14 each ($20
overseas). If you would like to purchase only a specific single copy (or
copies) of back issues, they are available for $4 each ($6 overseas). An
index and brief description of articles published in '96/'97 are available
on the Juiced.GS web site. See URL below.

Apple II Forever!


 Max Jones
 Juiced.GS
 Delphi: JuicedGS -- Internet: juicedgs@delphi.com
 World Wide Web:  http://www.wbwip.com/juiced.gs
                       (JUICEDGS, 16392, GO COM A2)


IT'S ALL OVER BUT THE SPELLING   If You Can Use A Mouse, You Can Spell
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   Correctly!

Shareware Solutions II, in association with Chris Vavruska, is pleased to
announce the release of NiftySpell, the first and only Universal Spell
Checker for the Apple IIGS computer.

NiftySpell is a flexible and easy to use New Desk Accessory (NDA) that
automatically loads whenever your system starts up. Once installed,
NiftySpell adds a new menu item to the Apple Pull Down menu, and it can be
accessed from any standard Apple IIGS program that supports New Desk
Accessories. With NiftySpell installed, you can spell check documents right
from your Finder Desktop or from within such diverse programs as Teach,
Hermes, Freecell or HyperStudio.

In addition to the NDA, there is also a special Spectrum XCMD included that
seamlessly integrates NiftySpell into the Spectrum telecommunications
program, making it very convenient to spell check your outgoing e-mail and
forum messages while using Spectrum or Spectrum Internet Suite v1.1!

With NiftySpell, you'll never again be embarrassed by sending out important
documents with spelling or typographical errors, and you'll always look
your best in print when the words you use to convey your thoughts are
spelled correctly.

Before NiftySpell, only those who used expensive word processing or desktop
publishing software packages like AppleWorks, AppleWorks GS or
GraphicWriter III could spell check their work. Now anyone has the
convenience of a spell checker within easy reach. If you can use a mouse,
you can spell correctly!

NiftySpell requires an Apple IIGS, System 6.0.1, and a hard disk drive. It
requires at least 512k of available RAM and at least 1.5 megabytes of hard
drive storage space.

NiftySpell is available from Shareware Solutions II for $20, which includes
postage to anywhere in the world.

To order NiftySpell, send checks or money orders to:

Joe Kohn
Shareware Solutions II
166 Alpine St
San Rafael, CA 94901
                       (JOE_KOHN, 16234, GO COM A2)


A FEW WORDS ON CHECKWORKS FROM THE PUBLISHER   With all the recent interest
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   shown in CheckWorks, I'd
like to add a few words...

CheckWorks is a set of sophisticated, integrated TimeOut modules that
operate within AppleWorks Classic. It is a complete checking account
management program that will let you do such things as write and print
checks, maintain a checkbook register, show current balances, and reconcile
checking account statements.

Because so many people are using so many different versions of AppleWorks,
those who purchase CheckWorks from Shareware Solutions II, will actually
receive three versions of CheckWorks on three 3.5" disk...one for AW 3, one
for AW 4.x and one for AW 5.x. For use with AppleWorks v4.x and 5.x,
nothing additional is required to run CheckWorks. However, in order to use
CheckWorks with AppleWorks v3, you must have UltraMacros 4.

The complete CheckWorks package is available from Shareware Solutions II
for only $20. Generally, SSII requests an additional $3 for CheckWorks'
postage, but as a means of expressing thanks to all the friendly folks here
on Delphi's A2 for their ongoing support, I will waive the $3 postage to
those who include a Delphi name (handle, logon name) with their order.

Send checks, money orders for CheckWorks to:

Joe Kohn
Shareware Solutions II
166 Alpine St
San Rafael, CA 94901-1008
USA
                       (JOE_KOHN, 15958, GO COM A2)


A2U PRESENTS: HYPERCARD IIGS
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
        A2U ANNOUNCEMENT: HyperCard IIgs course starting soon!
        ------------------------------------------------------

The Apple II University in the A2Pro Forum on Delphi is proud to present
its first course under the new management of Dean Jeff Blakeney.

Starting Saturday, the 19th of September, 1998, lessons will be uploaded to
the A2Pro's A2 University Database (go com a2p dat).  Lessons will continue
to be uploaded each Saturday.  Keep in mind that the lesson files could
take a day or two to be released for you to be able to download them.
There will be an announcement in A2Pro when the lessons are ready to be
downloaded.

This should give you enough time to download and read the each week's
lesson before the weekly Tuesday night HyperCard Bar & Grill conference (go
com a2p con) between 9:00 and 11:00 pm Eastern time.  This is HangTime's
regular HyperCard IIgs conference and HangTime will be available to answer
any questions that you have in real time.  You may even end up helping out
other students with advice or work arounds that you have discovered while
working through the lessons yourself.

If you have any questions but can't make it to the conferences, you can
post them to the A2Pro Forum's A2 University Topic (go com a2p for) and
your instructor, their assistants and your fellow students will be able to
help you to make sure you understand everything that is being taught.

The course will be taught by Gareth Jones who has been creating HyperCard
IIgs stacks for the past five years.  His early stacks are available from
the Ground FTP site (ftp://ground.ecn.uiowa.edu), while his later stacks
appear in _Hyper Quarterly_ (a monthly disk subscription; information and
screens shots are available at http://people.delphi.com/appleblossom/hq).

While not creating stacks, Gareth writes monthly articles on all things
Apple II for the user group newsletter _Apples B.C. News_, some of which
have been reprinted from Britain to California.  The newsletter articles he
has written about HCGS also appear on the Apple Blossom web site.

All you need to participate is an Apple IIgs computer with the necessary
hardware to run HyperCard IIgs and an interest in learning how to make use
of this versatile program.  HyperCard IIgs is available from many places
for free or a very small fee and many of the official HyperCard IIgs books
are available from The ByteWorks (http://www.hypermall.com/byteworks).

To summarise:

      Course:  HyperCard IIgs

  Instructor:  Gareth Jones
Assistant(s):  HangTime

Lesson schedule:
     o First lesson to be uploaded Saturday, 19th September, 1998
     o Lessons to be uploaded weekly
     o Questions can be asked in the A2U topic of A2Pro
     o Weekly chats will be held on Tuesdays between during HangTime's
       HyperCard Bar & Grille between 9:00 pm and 11:00 pm Eastern

Course requirements:
     o An Apple IIgs with 2 MB of RAM
     o A 3.5" floppy drive
     o A hard drive
     o HyperCard IIgs v1.1
     o Plus some others that will be mentioned in the first lesson.
                       (JBLAKENEY, 15971, GO COM A2)



                             BEST OF THE BEST
                             """"""""""""""""


16408 28-SEP 05:51 Telecommunications
     RE: All about Marinetti (Re: Msg 4456)
     From: RICHARD_B    To: ALL

Well, today (well, yesterday) is (was) the day.

Marinetti 2.0 is now released and available for download from the new
Marinetti Home Page:

     http://www.apple2.org/marinetti/

All the details are included with the archive, so I'll let you all read
that for the cool stuff.

Enjoy.

Regards,
 Richard




[EOA]
[A2P]------------------------------
                   A2Pro_DUCTIVITY |
-----------------------------------
Checking out A2PRO on Delphi
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W.
                    [thelamp@delphi.com]


MORE ON BABELFISHING VIA C   This has nothing to do with C, or ORCA for
""""""""""""""""""""""""""   that matter. It has to do with the fact that
you're calling code created by a compiler. The same issue exists for APW C,
TML BASIC, ORCA/Modula-2, and even assembly language.

The issue is that code makes some assumptions about the environment it runs
in. The only reason assembly language may have an advantage is that the
assumptions are right up front--but if some bonehead does something like
this in assembly:

sta there

...

there ds 2

without setting up the data bank register, you'll have the same problems in
the assembly language subroutine that you would have in an ORCA/C
subroutine that uses global variables without initializing the data bank
register.

The issue is, and always has been, that _any_ subroutine that makes
assumptions about its environment must be initialized so those assumptions
are true. Assembly is no different, but it is more obvious that you need to
do the initialization because you see the things you are doing more
directly than you do with a compiler.

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 2114, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Hi People! Long time no type! I remember the good old days back on
"""""   GEnie all the time, writing everything in assembly, patching OS
calls and tool calls, etc. etc. Sheppy!, remember me? I'm still alive...

Babelfish Translators...

My problem is that I don't remember this stuff - it has been too long. I
would not run away from C when writing these things. What kind of interface
could have been devised that would be all-language safe, anyway? BTW, I did
not originally design Babelfish, but as I remember things, it was one of
the most well-designed projects that I ever worked on! At least from a
developers point of view. It was fully-specified before code was written -
how many people can say that about their projects! Anyway, here's my
possible solution/summary...

How do you write a CDev in Orca/C? Just think about that question, get a
full answer, and do the Translator the same way following the same
principals. I would love to me more specific, but I just cannot remember
all the details.

Of course you cannot call malloc(), fopen(), strstr(), fabs(), etc from
your code resource! (Did someone say they were going to do floating point
math...) Maybe you can, I don't think I ever knew how to do that. However,
as Mike pointed out and I was not aware - the code generation can add
library calls when you do something as "innocent" as dereference an array!

So, get out the old "Code Resource in C" section of the manual and check it
out (CDev, CDEF, MDEF, Finder Extension, Request Procedures, etc, etc).

Bill
                         (WTUDOR, 2116, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Bill,
"""""
Glad to see you here on Delphi. I hope you regularly drop in. I took a look
at your Debug translator C source. (Thanks Ewen!) I noticed you did not use
the #pragma noroot as suggested by Mike W.  Do you recall if this was in
fact the case? It seems you didn't bother with most of the points Mike
expressed concerns about and still were able to write some very usable
translators. So, there definitely is some hope for using C in writing these
things (especially if I try to cover what Mike has pointed out).

One question for Bill or anyone else 'in the know':

I noticed Bill used saveDBR() and restoreDBR() in his code. Is this an APW
equivalent to the ORCA/C #pragma databank directive? I assume saveDBR and
restoreDBR means save/restore direct bank register?

Thanks,

Paul.
                        (SCHULTP, 2121, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   It is possible that I was using the APW/C compiler for that
"""""   translator. It is also possible that I was using an earlier Orca/C
compiler. I think the SaveDB/RestoreDB functions just did a phk/plb (saving
the old DBR first) and restore the old DBR later. I don't remember where
they came from.

                         (WTUDOR, 2123, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   You don't have to use the noroot pragma--you can just delete .root
"""""   later. :)

If you do complete initialization of the ORCA/C environment, you _can_ use
malloc(), free(), stdio.h, floating-point, and so forth. One of the
advantages to rolling your own .root segment with the initialization done
by you, rather that using a prepackaged pragma written by me, is that you
have some choice. If you don't need stdio.h and floating point (which I
imagine would normally be the case) you don't have to initialize them.

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 2124, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Just what is exactly meant by the "complete" initialization. I read
"""""   the manual and it says in a couple places that you should call
these routines if your program is not called in the "usual" way. What is
the "usual" way? Is only a S16/EXE considered the "usual" way?

Thanks

Chris
                       (CVAVRUSKA, 2128, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   A complete initialization would make all aspects of ORCA/C function
"""""   properly. It would be safe to use malloc(), stdio.h calls and
floating point.

> I read the manual and it says in a couple places that you should call
these
> routines if your program is not called in the "usual" way. What is the
> "usual" way? Is only a S16/EXE considered the "usual" way?

Basically, yes. Here's a more detailed answer:

At the current time, ORCA/C supports several fully functional ways of
creating a program. S16/EXE is one of them. There are also pragmas for
safely creating PIFs, XCMDs, and so forth. (See the manual for details.) If
you are creating a program that is not an S16 or EXE program, you need to
do the initialization. The pragmas do that for you. If you are creating a
program that is not an S16 or EXE program, and for which there is no
prewritten pragma, then you need to roll your own. You can do that by
writing a custom .root segment that you link into your program or, for most
of the initializations, by calling the subroutines listed in the manual.

The really tricky one is SANE, used for floating-point support. SANE needs
a direct page area. The ORCA/C libraries get the direct page area by
stealing 256 bytes from the stack, using a technique that generally doesn't
work from environments like Babelfish. It's difficult to set that up
properly from ORCA/C by calling the prewritten subroutines. You can, of
course, just start SANE on your own.

If you're going to do this, I'd suggest that you make sure you have a copy
of the subroutine library source, and perhaps disassemble a few of the
different .root segments created by the various pragmas. That will show you
clear examples of what _I_ did to support similar environments. An NBA or
an XCMD are pretty similar to Babelfish. The principal difference is that a
Babelfish translator is not a single program, it's four.

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 2130, GO COM A2)


A2PRO HASHES OUT JAVA AND OTHER LANGUAGES   Well, I just can't sit idly by
"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   while you disparage a language
I happen to like quite a lot. :-) And nobody "convinced me" of this. It was
my own conclusion. I admit it's not perfect, and I don't care much for its
C++-like syntax, but I'd take it any day over C++.

Apart from the OOP extensions to ORCA/Pascal (which, I admit, I have not
look at), there is no full implementation of a standard object- oriented
language for the IIgs, let alone one as portable as Java. There is a =heck=
of a lot of Java applications (not applets) out there, most of which would
probably run just fine on the IIgs if we had a Java VM (and preferably a
JIT). Also, with Java, you get an extensive and well-designed class
library.

And since Sun's compiler is actually written in Java, it should run (albeit
slowly) once you've got the VM running. A native compiler would be better,
of course (speed-wise), but as you suggested, Mike, that would take some
time. It would permit the compilation to native 65816 code, though, which
would allow Java to be used as a native IIgs programming language, as an
alternative to the C++ compiler that everyone keeps asking for.

-- Michael
                          (SAR, 2140, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Heck, I've disparage'd better languages than Java. ;) You should
"""""   hear what I say about Pascal... and I _like_ Pascal!

You're right about the Aplet issue, and I did mention that. But I doubt if
many people are going to take up Java simply because it supports object
oriented programming.

If you're really interested in object oriented programming, Object Pascal
is one thing that works very well. (You did mention it, but seemed to
ignore it. Some people just don't like Pascal much. Whatever.) There's also
a port of SmallTalk, although I doubt if it runs much faster than Java
based on J-code would.

And honestly, I'm surprised no one ever ported one of the C++ to C
cross-compilers. Apple used one for a while under MPW. The same technique
would work quite well under ORCA.

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 2151, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I haven't been able to *find* any C++ to C cross compiler sources,
"""""   or I'd have tried it already.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                         (SHEPPY, 2152, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   For somebody who doesn't know C++ or Java (ie. me), but does know
"""""   the principles of OOP etc., what are the benefits of Java over C++,
ignoring the SUPPOSED portability.

Regards,
 Richard
                       (RICHARD_B, 2141, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Well, speaking as someone with only a couple semesters using c/c++,
"""""   and just one semester of JAVA, the reason _I_ like java is because
it is _simpler_ in syntax than C/C++, without all the tricks and quirks
that have grown with those two languages over the years. It's more
straightforward to use, and gives you the benefits of OOP without even
having to mess with pointers and all the confusion that THEY cause the
neophyte programmer.

My school is going to start using JAVA to teach their CS 1 course next
year.

I know that's a wimpy attitude, but hey, I'm a wimpy programmer.  Hell, I
even like Visual Basic!   :)

_________
  | homas
                        (TCOMPTER, 2148, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   Automatic memory management (garbage collection), a simpler syntax,
"""""   and an excellent class library are probably the biggest advantages,
off the top of my head. Memory management is the biggest source of errors
in C and C++ programs, and it's tedious. There are no pointers in Java,
just class references, which avoids a lot of value passing issues and
prevents you from messing with objects directly.

Java has "interfaces" that define a set of methods for classes to
implement, and any class that implements the interface can be manipulated
by something that uses that interface. In C++, you would have to use an
abstract class to do the same sort of thing, which isn't as nice.

I really liked Java's exception system, but C++ also now has exceptions,
and I imagine they are probably very similar to Java's, but it seems like
they aren't used much yet (in C++). In Java, the whole class library uses
them. Exceptions allow you to separate your error handling code from the
regular code, and functions don't have to waste their return value on an
error code. Like with the IIgs toolbox, the error result is separated from
the function result (although you can only have one or the other from a
Java function).

Another plus for Java is that you don't need separate header and
implementation files in Java. Finally, Java also has language support for
multithreading.

There are certainly limitations in Java. For example, it only supports
single inheritance, but I've found that the interface mechanism is quite
adequate and avoids the pitfalls of multiple inheritance. The lack of
enumerations is a bit of an inconvenience, and there's no "preprocessor" so
that means no conditional compilation or macros, which means there's
currently no nice way to have ASSERTs and debug code that is automatically
left out of a release build. However, there are Java compilers with both of
these latter features, but they're not in the standard.

The fact that there is a standard, and a simple one, plus a reference
compiler, is a plus for Java. C++ has only just finally been standardized
and it will probably be some time yet before there are any compilers that
support the entire, very complex standard exactly to the letter.

I'm sure I missed several issues, but maybe others will jump in to add
more.

-- Michael
                          (SAR, 2172, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Well, for one Java is even slower than C++ ... oh wait, that's not
"""""   really a benefit, is it?

Devin
                       (GLYNREADE, 2181, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I disagree with this statement. Here's why:
"""""
With a few exceptions, like LISP and Cobol, one language is not
significantly faster or slower than another when the languages are
implemented by equally skilled programmers--yet the "speed" of a language
has torpedoed more than one superior language.

One example of a "slow" language is Pascal, which "everyone" knows is
slower than FORTRAN or C. Hogwash. In point of fact, Pascal is generally
slightly faster, due to the fact that it's clean design allowed some
optimizations that are not possible on either FOTRAN or C. The difference
is negligible, but if you want to be picky, it's a faster language. Compare
ORCA/Pascal and ORCA/C, which use the same code generator, on standard
benchmarks: When there is a difference at all, Pascal slightly edges C out
on looping, although C does better on some benchmarks if you use unsigned
numbers. (That's more an artifact of the 65816 than the language, though.
On a 68K, PowerMac or Pentium the signed/unsigned advantage disappears--and
you can actually get unsigned math in ORCA/Pascal using subranges.)

So why is Pascal slow? Because people based their impression on the most
common early implementation, the UCSD P-System. They didn't bother to
notice that UCSD FORTRAN was just as slow.

Another example is Ada, which got a terrible reputation for slow speed, but
at a time when only demonstration compilers--few of them optimizing, and
some of them p-code based--were available for comparison. Hardly a fair
test, yet "everyone" knows Ada is slow.

Java is no different. It is typically implemented as a p-code like system.
Of course it's slow. Sometimes it's implemented as a just-in-time compiler.
That's slower than an optimizing compiler, too. But a scratch-written
optimizing compiler for Java, written to compile directly to native code,
should not show significant speed differences from other common languages.
And a C, Pascal, BASIC, or FORTRAN compiler written to compile to J-code
for execution as an aplet will be just as slow as Java.

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 2183, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   Mike hit it on the nose. There are a number of Java compilers now
"""""   which compile to native code, and can be used to write the same
kinds of programs that you could in C++. And they will run just as fast. In
fact, there are those who claim that even the JITs can compile Java code to
run as fast =or faster= than comparable C++ code. This is at least partly
due to the difficulty of optimizing a language as complex as C++, as
compared to Java.

I've never done any side-by-side tests myself, I just prefer the Java
language and figure that eventually the speed won't be an issue (as
compilers and JITs improve). It's also quite easy to write a really =bad=
C++ program which will often result in any speed gains being lost.
Unfortunately, I see this more often than not. I just came off a project
where the code we inherited was so awful that there really wasn't we could
do to fix in the time we had. It was obvious that the people who wrote the
code did not have even a decent understanding of the language. Anyway,
thankfully that's over.

-- Michael
                          (SAR, 2186, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   You know, the cool thing about posts from Mike, is that he's
"""""   actually written all the stuff he talks about.

You see this long detailed post about compilers and languages and all such
wonders, and you feel like saying "yeah, well what would you know about
compilers", just for the hell of it.

When Mike posts, it usually ends the thread. Not good for Delphi, but
certainly good for the Apple II world. There's so many different experts
here, its great.

Ain't the Apple II community a wonderful place. :-)

Regards,
 Richard
                       (RICHARD_B, 2184, GO COM A2)


C PROGRAMMING HELP ON DEMAND   The following is a short code segment and
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   the resulting ORCA/C 2.1.0 compiler output.
Anyone have an idea why this is giving me an error?

Thanks,

Paul.

====================================================================

#include <stddef.h>

typedef enum {actnSpec, actnByte, actnWord} ACTN;
typedef enum {propChp, propPap, propSep, propDop} PROPTYPE;

typedef struct char_prop
{
    char fBold;
    char fUnderline;
    char fItalic;
} CHP;                  // CHaracter Properties

typedef struct propmod
{
    ACTN actn;              // size of value
    PROPTYPE prop;          // structure containing value
    int offset;          // offset of value from base of structure
} PROP;

PROP rgprop [1] = {
    actnByte,   propChp,    offsetof(CHP, fBold),       // ipropBold
};
======================================================================
ORCA/C 2.1.0

Including :gno:ORCA.2.1:LIBRARIES:ORCACDefs:stddef.h
  23     actnByte,   propChp,    offsetof(CHP, fBold),       // ipropBold
                                                     ^ illegal operand in
a constant expression

1 error found.
                        (SCHULTP, 2174, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   The compiler is telling you that offsetof(CHP, fBold) can't be
"""""   resolved as a constant at compile time, so it can't be used as an
initializer for a static variable. How is offsetof() defined? You'll either
have to change offsetof, use something else, or initialize the value at
run-time.

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 2175, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   Mike,
"""""
From ORCA/C 2.1.0 and its <stddef.h>:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
typedef unsigned long size_t;

#define offsetof(type,member) ((size_t) (&(((type *)0L)->member)))

So, this would make offsetof(CHP,fBold):

unsigned long &((CHP*)->fBold)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------

It appears to me that offsetof() is trying to give me the address of the
fBold member of the structure CHP.

The code I am trying to compile is the rtfreader C source from Microsoft.
In the source, a comment states that the member 'offset' in the structure
PROP is the "offset of value from base of structure". The error I am
getting is when they try to use offsetof() from stddef.h to calculate the
value for the 'offset' member of PROP. [Note: from the original posting, my
errors were occurring in an array of type PROP -- a structure containing
the mentioned offset member].

It seems to me that the Microsoft code is expecting offsetof() to return
something different than what the ORCA/C offsetof() is returning. The
ORCA/C offsetof() from stddef.h (as shown above) looks like it is returning
an address. Specifically, the Microsoft code expects offsetof() to return
the offset from the beginning of the structure and not an absolute address.
Am I right? Or, am I missing something?

Does anyone have the offsetof() from Microsoft's stddef.h for comparison?

Thanks,

Paul.

Paul Schultz
schultp@delphi.com
sent your way via Spectrum 2.1 and Crock O' Gold 2.5
                        (SCHULTP, 2176, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Paul, the offsetof() macro is returning a value of type size_t,
"""""   which is correct: size_t is defined in ANSI-C as an integer value
large enough to hold the largest pointer when the pointer is converted to
an integer--in other words, casting a pointer to type size_t and saving it,
then converting the size_t value back to a pointer should not change the
value.

Whatever.

The value returned is a long integer, not a pointer. (I forget if it's
signed or unsigned; you can look in the headers if you care. It doesn't
matter for this discussion.)

The problem, though, has to do with the fact that ORCA/C wasn't able to
resolve the macro to a constant at compile time. The solution is to use a
constant or use the macro later in executable code.

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 2177, GO COM A2)


WHEN THE AUTHOR NEEDS HELP WITH GSOFT BASIC, HE TURNS TO A2PRO   I'm
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   running
into a weird problem with GSoft BASIC. I'm hoping someone can save me the
trouble of disassembling Apple's Control Panel to find out what the problem
is.

Here's the situation:

GSoft BASIC is doing some behind the scenes work to convince the O/S that
it's OK for an interpreted program to have its own resource fork. In
particular, it's assigning it's own user ID and intercepting the Loader's
LGetPathName and LGetPathName2 calls, telling calling applications
(specifically the StartUpTools call) the correct pathname for the
interpreted file. It only intercepts these calls if the user ID passed by
the call matches the user ID assigned to the interpreted file. GSoft BASIC
also intercepts the GS/OS GetName call.

That actually works fine. Desktop programs are working, and StartupTools
works just peachy.

The problem is that some desk accessories, like Apple's Control Panel, are
also using LGetPathname2. That's OK, but they are also using the
interpreted application's user ID (why?!?!?) and, after getting the
interpreted program's path name, they report an error or crash in various
ways. Apple's control panel does a System Death call with a resource error,
saying it couldn't load resource type $800C (a P-string) with a resource ID
from outer space ($36B6B6B6). One other NDA fails with a similar error, but
with a resource ID of 1.

Presumably the resource failure is connected to the LGetPathname2 call,
although I have not disassembled the code to find out for sure.

Does anyone know why these NDAs might fail in this way? Even simpler, does
anyone know why an NDA would be asking the loader for my application's path
name?

I suspect there is another call I need to intercept and patch, but I don't
know what it is. Any ideas?

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 2193, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   My first guess is that something's wrong somewhere else entirely:
"""""   maybe these NDAs are using some call or other (GetCurResourceApp,
perhaps?) to get the user ID of whoever is currently in charge,
resource-wise, and getting the wrong value at some point. Or maybe your
changes cause these NDAs to be passed back the interpreted application's
user ID as their own?

That's actually the most likely case, I think.

The other possibility is that they're calling LGetPathname2 to see if a
certain app is running, so they can adjust their behavior in some manner...
but it seems that the GS/OS GetName call would be better for that, so this
seems unlikely to me.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                         (SHEPPY, 2194, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   I had a similar problem with Marinetti and the Control Panels NDA.
"""""   The solution for me was to move all the relevant resources into
data segments. I didn't feel like patching all over the place to support my
own resources. I also figured because of the way Marinetti fits into GS/OS,
it was probably better not to mess with resources any way.

What I would like to know though, is why you're patching so many GS/OS
calls. Although you're using interpreted code, surely you're just an
application like anyone else? Just interested...

Like Sheppy says, Control Panels does a lot of res ID manipulation and even
messes with control parameter blocks if it thinks it owns them. My problem
was several depths of module calls, each with their own resources, called
from a CDev. Different problem, CDev. Different problem, but comes from the
same Control Panels logic.

Regards,
 Richard
                       (RICHARD_B, 2200, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   The problem Mike's having is this:
"""""
You have an application, GSoft.Sys16, which is the interpreter. It loads a
file that contains the program to run and the resources that program needs.

The program is run, and it calls StartUpTools. The Resource Manager goes
"Let's see, the currently-running application is GSoft.Sys16. Hey! It's
already started the Resource Manager, what's this idiot programmer doing?"
and returns an error.

Additionally, if the program calls MMStartUp, it gets GSoft's user ID back
(it's data owned by GSoft, after all). So MMStartUp has to be patched.

The end result is probably about 5 or 6 toolbox calls that wind up needing
various patches, so the GSoft program can look and act like a real
application.

This isn't a problem when you've used MakeRuntime to build a launchable
app, but when testing during development from the ORCA or GSoft shell, it's
a serious problem.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                         (SHEPPY, 2201, GO COM A2)


GNO MORE WAITING?  WELL AT LEAST A LITTLE MORE   Many people have been
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   wondering for a long time,
"When will GNO v2.0.6 be released?".  Some have questioned if it will ever
be released.  Here is the status; in short, it's a mixture of good news and
slightly bad news.

First, the bad news.

I had wanted the release of GNO v2.0.6 to come as a fairly integrated
package where the installation process was (almost) completely automated,
everything was available as source that could be built using the current
compilers, et al.  While one of my goals is still to get the base GNO
distribution to this state, it is not there yet.

I had also commented to some people in email and on Delphi that I wanted to
make a major GNO release by KFest '98.  Well, a residential move, family
medical problems, a corporate move, and other things got in the way.  KFest
'98 has come and gone, and GNO still isn't released.

Now the good news.

It's time to make a much overdue major GNO release.

There are a few stages to such a release.  Over the next few weeks you can
expect the following to happen:

        - a binary release will be available via anonymous ftp.  This,
          while still lacking in certain respects, is what most people
          will want to eventually download.  The initial one may
          merely be the most recent binary release distributed to the
          the GNO Developers' group.

        - most sources will become available via anonymous cvs
          and anonymous ftp.  Not all sources will be available
          (such as those for the modified Byteworks' libraries)
          because of their proprietary nature, however the majority
          of sources will be available.

          Initially sources by ftp will be available only as individual
          source files, but I will get it set up so that you can get
          NuFX (GShrinkit) archives of portions of the source directory
          tree.  Sources will not be available as a single *.shk file
          because there are too many of them.

        - Documentation (web pages, reference manual, et cetera) will
          be updated.  This is actually an ongoing process, so if you
          have any suggestions/corrections for the documentation,
          please let me know.

Other things also have to get sorted out, like the list of what has still
to be done, the necessary procedures for those who want to make
contributions, and so forth.  This will be done as we have time available.

This won't happen overnight, though, as I am involved in yet another
residential move.  (Landlord problems prompted us to finally go and buy a
house, and we're moving next weekend.)

Don't get your hopes up too high though. There are still some major
problems with GNO v2.0.6, mostly because there's "so much work, so little
time".  For example, there are some core components (like syslogd) that
were rewritten but still require work.  There are certain aspects of the
GNO v2.0.6 kernel that are less stable than the 2.0.4 kernel; of course,
there are also kernel aspects which are *more* stable in v2.0.6.  However,
in the spirit of "The Cathedral and the Bazaar", I hope that things will go
better after the sources are on general release.

Please don't continually flood me with email about when each stage is
coming.  As each stage is ready, I'll post a notice on comp.sys.apple2.gno
and the Delphi A2Pro forum.  Speaking of which, I usually host a GNO
programmers' real time conference on Delphi Mondays and Thursdays from 10pm
to midnight, Eastern time.  While I may not be around for the next couple
of weeks, feel free to drop in anytime; I should be back in October.

I would like to finish by thanking the GNO Development team, especially
Dave Tribby who has been churning out utility updates and bug fixes like
crazy.  (The list of contributors is in the current GNO Overview and
Installation Reference Manual at http://www.gno.org/~gno/refs.html.)

So keep tuned to comp.sys.apple2.gno and Delphi A2Pro for updates.

-- Devin

PS:  I realized that this was a bit out of date as I was uploading it;
     the residential move is done.
                       (GLYNREADE, 2178, GO COM A2)


JAVA FOR THE IIGS AND HOW IT COULD BE DONE   It depends a lot on how you do
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""   it.

If you get a license from, say, Sun and implement an interpreter for Java's
J-code, it's a pretty reasonable project. Say a few dozen hours for a
competent assembly language programmer. (That's a guess; I would carefully
study the specs for J-code before making a real estimate.)

The result would work, but it would be pretty slow. There would also be
restrictions on distribution, but I'm not sure what they would be. You
might also have to develop the Java programs on another machine. I'm not
sure if the Sun Java license includes the Java compiler, which converts
programs to J-code.

The next level up is a "just-in-time" style compiler. This takes J-code and
compiles it to machine code. Depending on how good a job you do, this could
take anywhere from a few weeks to a year or two. If you do a great job, the
result should work as well as some of the current Apple IIGS compilers. You
would still have some distribution restrictions.

For the most part, the only sane reason to use Java is to develop web
applets. Unless you're trying to tie this thing to a web browser of some
sort, or run applets downloaded from the web, there's no reason I can think
of to have Java on the Apple IIGS. But perhaps you've been convinced by
someone that Java is actually a good computer language in its own right.
Well, that person's grandfather probably sold snake oil to your
grandmother, but you're entitled to your opinion. ;) In that case, you
might consider developing a traditional compiler for Java. Assuming you
don't develop the environment, too, and that you start from scratch so
there are no distribution hassles, you're looking at a one to two year
(full time) project for one to two people.

So, like I said, the answer depends on your approach and goals.

Mike Westerfield
(Whose written enough compilers and interpreters to know what this would
take!)
                       (BYTEWORKS, 2136, GO COM A2)


HOW SOUNDIT SOUNDS OFF   Basically, SoundIt is installing a Request Handler
""""""""""""""""""""""   that watches for the finderSaysBeforeOpen IPC
request, and when it sees one that contains a sound file, it loads the
sounds, plays it, then returns from the request call with a message telling
the Finder not to bother opening the file (which would normally cause it to
launch an application to handle it).

Dave
                        (JUSTDAVE, 2119, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   When you click the icon, the Finder sends a 'FinderSaysBeforeOpen'
"""""   message which gets picked up the Sound CDev, and anything else that
is listening. The first application to accept the message, in this case the
Sound CDev, plays the sound.

This is all explained in the System 6 Reference.

 Ewen Wannop - Speccie
 Delivered without using a IIgs by Spectrum & Crock O' Gold 2.5!
 Setup: Bernie ][ the Rescue 1.3 and a PowerMac 8200/120
 http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/ewannop/
                        (EWANNOP, 2120, GO COM A2)


MORE GSBUG DEBATES   Richard: Yes. I had a shock: How ugly it is designed.
""""""""""""""""""   It reminds me of Vi under Unix.

The ability to step and trace is nice. Break points can be handled by NF
Debugger as well as display and modify memory. Much better than GSBug,
since it works together with NF Assembler, you can display your labels
easily, choose different display formats, etc.

For me, it is more sensible to work with NF Debugger. The only drawback is
that is hasn't got step and trace functions, but that could maybe easily be
built in with breaks.

I already did an update (NOT yet available on our homepage), that displays
tables and cleans things up a bit.

Hm. Does ORCA or Merlin pass label information to GSBug? I didn't found
that (but I didn't look for it, either).

Jesse Blue / Ninjaforce

Check out our upcoming Apple IIGS game at:
http://www.ninjaforce.home.ml.org
                       (JESSEBLUE, 2122, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Not really. GSBug doesn't support that directly. There is a
"""""   facility for naming breakpoints that is independent of the language
used to create the program. I don't use it, so I can't tell you much about
it.

Mike Westerfield
                       (BYTEWORKS, 2126, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   Oh boy, is this gonna be an interesting thread or what. :)
"""""
Ugly? No, the interface to the ProDev debugging card, now that's UGLY!

You know, its hard to argue the point for GSBug when I haven't seen your
debugger, and to be honest there's no way a quick stop in GSBug can
possibly show you all the benefits.

The screen layout can be changed very easily by typing "SET" and using
various keys to adjust the screen to your liking. While in SET mode, "S"
also toggles stack offsets.

From any step and trace mode, "S" "H" "4" "8" and a half dozen other keys
change the displays from graphics to text etc.

OFF and ON on the command line turn off the GSBug display to display the
active text screen.

BP allows you to set up real time break points, triggered by count or first
hit. MP allows you to set windows of memory protection and real time
execution, bypassing tracing through code which you know works, such as
toolbox calls (hold down option on a toolbox call, and GSBug will ignore
the window and trace the call).

You can debug to disk, and view the trace back later, with all the register
and memory display showing up, and you can use the arrow keys to go back
and forth in the trace. I find this hand with beta testers. They can
step/trace a problem and send me the trace file. I can then load it into
GSBug and watch what they were doing.

MEM goes into the memory display. You can type in a long address, or hit
"Z" to make it a direct page location. You can also hit "P" to show a 16
bit pointer, "L" to show long, "H" to show hex/ascii, and three levels of
depth in dereferencing by typing ":"

During stepping, (space bar after hitting "S" to start stepping) you can
hit "X" to execute subroutine (within bank and long) at real time. Down
arrow skips an instruction. Of course you can type an address followed by
"S", "T" or "R" to exit GSBug.

There's a calculator at the prompt, plus a hex/ascii display by typing an
address, then a colon, then return.

What else, um, you can set break points on tool calls and OS calls. For
example, you want to know where Finder quits, issue a settbrk_quit. Want to
trace your code from a particular tool call, sure settbrk_toolcall.

And this is just scratching the surface, there are literally hundreds of
features which aren't documented in GSBug itself, but are in the
documentation.

Oh yeah, I should just mention it does record templates, like Nifty List
and Pixie, and this started with your mention of eyecatchers, which GSBug
supports Apple's embedded eyecatchers. The only thing it doesn't do which
you've mentioned is displaying labels, but then again, I doubt it would
have supported Merlin labels, and anyway, the eyecatchers I find a lot
handier, as you can code the label or a debug message.

Regards,
 Richard
                       (RICHARD_B, 2134, GO COM A2)

>>>>>   GSBug is IMHO just about the best-designed debugger out there for
"""""   any platform I've worked with. It has flaws, and it has bugs, but
it's easier to use, in general, than any other machine-level debugger I've
tried.

Eric "Sheppy" Shepherd
Macintosh & PowerPC Programmers Forum
                         (SHEPPY, 2139, GO COM A2)

<<<<<   That all sounds very nice, but seems to be aimed at toolbox/desktop
"""""   programmers, since quite a lot is based on toolbox interaction.

What I want to do with a debugger is: stop a program during execution and
have a look at all my variables (=labels), and be able to view my code in a
disassembly, so I can see what happens. I rarely use the toolbox.

But I think the whole debate is useless (although it's nice), since I won't
use GSBUG, because then I would have to use GS/OS, and you won't use NF
Debugger because then you would have to code under NF Assembler.

Jesse Blue / Ninjaforce

Check out our upcoming Apple IIGS game at:
http://www.ninjaforce.home.ml.org
                       (JESSEBLUE, 2142, GO COM A2)




[EOA]
[FRE]------------------------------
                FREEWARE FAVORITES |
-----------------------------------
QUIT-TO
"""""""
by Ryan M. Suenaga, B.A., M.S.W., L.S.W.
                    [thelamp@delphi.com]

                                  QUIT-TO
                                  ~~~~~~~

          Product Name:      Quit-To
          Distribution:      Freeware; available in the Delphi A2
                             Database, Genie A2 Library, and Apple II ftp
                             sites.
                             Karl Bunker
          Requirements:      Apple IIgs; 33k disk space.


     Unlike the Mac OS or Windows, the standard Apple II operating systems
(including GS/OS) don't allow you to run more than one program at once
(arguments about Desk Accessories and true multitasking notwithstanding).
While this is a minor inconvenience, it becomes a major one for the
neophyte who starts up in _Finder_, then runs _HyperStudio_, then quits
back to _Finder_ only to immediately start up _GShien_.  Can't we just
shortcut and bypass the _Finder_?

     Well, of course you can.  There are several solutions to this problem,
including using _Transprog III_ from Seven Hills.  However, say you want to
go directly from a ProDOS 8 program to another program--you won't have the
advantage of having the GS/OS desktop with the _Transprog III_ selection in
the menu bar.  What to do?

     Simple.  Use _Quit-To_, one of the wondrous freeware Classic Desk
Accessories by Karl Bunker.  _Quit-To_ does just one thing and it does it
well: it lets you select which program you want to run after you quit your
current program.

     You access _Quit-To_ like any other CDA--simply enter the Classic
Control Panel with the command-control-escape sequence, scroll down to the
"Quit-To" selection, and hit return.  When you quit the program you're
currently in, instead of returning to _Finder_ (or an alternative program
launcher) you'll end up in the program you wanted to run next.

     To extend the abilities of this neat little program, you can also
create a "Run List" that lets you keep a list all of your favorite programs
and select them from it.  This makes using _Quit-To_ even easier.

     _Quit-To_ uses the text interface, so it's fast and simple.  Because
it's a CDA, it's also accessible both by ProDOS 8 and GS/OS programs, and
due to Karl Bunker's generosity, it's also free.

     _Quit-To_, in the tradition of the Apple II, is functional if not
flashy.  It's also free, thanks to the generosity of Karl Bunker.  I
recommend this program without reservation to any IIgs user.



         :: DISCUSSED ON DELPHI ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
         :                                                       :
         :                  Windows is a pane.                   :
         :                                                       :
         ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::: LUMITECH ::::::



[EOA]
[INN]------------------------------
                     EXTRA INNINGS |
-----------------------------------
About The Lamp!   The Lamp! is published on the fifteenth of every month in
"""""""""""""""   the Database of the II Scribe Forum on the Delphi online
service (GO CUS 11).

This publication produced entirely with real or emulated Apple II computers
using Appleworks 5.1 and Hermes.  Apple II Forever!

     * The Lamp! is (c) copyright 1998 by Ryan M. Suenaga, M.S.W.  All
       rights reserved.

     * To reach The Lamp! on Internet email send mail to
       thelamp@delphi.com.

     * Back issues of The Lamp! are available in the II Scribe Forum on
       Delphi as well as The Lamp! Home Page,
       http://lamp.sheppyware.net.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Opinions expressed herein are those of  the individual authors, and do  not
necessarily  represent  the  opinions   of  the  Delphi  Online   Services,
Syndicomm, Inc.,  or  Ryan M.  Suenaga.     Forum  messages  are  reprinted
verbatim and  are included  in this  publication with  permission from  the
individual authors.   Delphi Online Services,  Syndicomm, Inc. and  Ryan M.
Suenaga  do not guarantee  the accuracy or  suitability of any  information
included herein.  We reserve the right to edit all letters and copy.

Material published  in  this  edition  may not  be  reprinted  without  the
expressed  written consent  of the  publisher.   Registered  computer  user
groups, not  for profit  publications ,  and other  interested parties  may
write the publisher to apply for permission to reprint any or all material.
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<



[EOF]

